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Just got a chance to check over the 17 Tri Glide today. She's been sitting, waiting for the warm weather again.
It's a good thing I did. Looks like I need a new drive belt. She's got a bunch of cogs/teeth missing in one spot. Only 16,000 miles.
This outta be fun and expensive too !
Anybody out there replaced their belt yet ? I reckon this is why they say DON'T do hole shots and wheelie's.
Curious to know as well.
Good on you posting this
[QUOTE=Bouncer;961264]Just got a chance to check over the 17 Tri Glide today. She's been sitting, waiting for the warm weather again.
It's a good thing I did. Looks like I need a new drive belt. She's got a bunch of cogs/teeth missing in one spot. Only 16,000 miles.
This outta be fun and expensive too !
Anybody out there replaced their belt yet ? I reckon this is why they say DON'T do hole shots and wheelie's.[/QUOTE]
It's about an 8 hour job- for me anyway. No ones paying me and if they were and complained I'd tell to them to get their machine off my hilltop fire support base and drop 81mm HE on them as they rolled down the mountain. I hate ingratitude.
[QUOTE=Old Road Dog;961295]It's about an 8 hour job- for me anyway. No ones paying me and if they were and complained I'd tell to them to get thire machine off my hilltop fire support base and drop 81mm HE on them as they rolled down the mountain. I hate ingratitude.[/QUOTE]
Thanks. I have the body off. I've seen a video where a guy replaced his belt on a 2021 and kept the body on. He said it took him over 12 hours. That's probably why.
Couple of questions if you don't mind. I have a Harley service manual for the trike. Just haven't read it yet.
My rear pulley looks worn too and I'd like to remove and thoroughly inspect it and the cush drive rubbers too. Do both axels have to come out to remove the pulley?
By looking at it, I'm going to drop the rear axel housing first, then the swing arm separately. Sound correct ?
Does the lower cross over exhaust pipe need to be removed ?
Since I'm in there, I'm going to replace the front transmission pulley too. Going from the 30 tooth pulley to the 32 tooth that Harley used when the Tri Glide first came out.
The 30 tooth was Harley's fix for the early low powered Tri Glides. These M8's have plenty of power now. I usually skip every other gear when shifting.
Now my rear belt tension has always been tight to Harley specifications. I believe the belt damage is do to my shenanigans but I don't know why the rear pulley looks so worn. The only times I've seen worn rear pulleys is because the belt was too loose. That's never been the case here.
Alinement. Now I could align the rear-end by rotating the tires and getting the belt to ride center of the pulley or get the rear tires inline with the front tire and let the belt ride the pulley where it will. Your thoughts ? Thanks again.
Do you think it’s possible that you picked up a rock or some other debris that lodged in your belt and caused the damage? Maybe that would explain the pulley wear?
I've had mine replace on my 17 TG twice.
Both times it was because a rock, stick or something else got stuck between the guard and the belt wearing a groove in it.
I ride some gravel and backroads that get a lot of small limbs when the wind gets high.
I now won't ride over 10 MPH on gravel. The limbs I miss most of the time but sometimes they are just unavoidable.
I also made a custom front fender skirt that is ~2" longer than stock so the front tire would not kick rock up high enough to get caught.
Both times I rode it quite a while before getting them replaced and only replaced them because I had a long trip planned.
I don't ride it hard, so I haven't any issues with the teeth.
The first time I got insurance to pay for it on comprehensive comparing it to a rock hitting a windshield on a car.
The second time was out of pocket and was about $1000 - $1200 at the dealer.
Bob
[QUOTE=RKplus10;961311]Do you think it’s possible that you picked up a rock or some other debris that lodged in your belt and caused the damage? Maybe that would explain the pulley wear?[/QUOTE]
I'd like to say possibly but I know it was driver abuse.
[QUOTE=Bouncer;961306]Alinement. Now I could align the rear-end by rotating the tires and getting the belt to ride center of the pulley or get the rear tires inline with the front tire and let the belt ride the pulley where it will. Your thoughts ? Thanks again.[/QUOTE]
I picked up a chip seal rock and it punched a hole clear through my belt. That was over 5 years ago and I still haven't changed the belt. But I don't have any missing teeth. I would never have noticed it if I wasn't under the trike doing some unrelated work.
If it breaks on the road I'll have an extended stay at Best Western, I guess.
As far as alignment goes, there is a specific procedure detailed in the shop manual. It doesn't look difficult to align the axle using the lock nuts.
Let us know how it goes. Those belts are supposed to be pretty durable.
Old Road Dog,
Wondering where you got your 81MM experience?
[I][COLOR=#000000]I now won't ride over 10 MPH on gravel.
[/COLOR][/I][COLOR=#000000]Was concerned about that too when I got my Tglide as there was no belt guard. So I looked around for an attractive mud guard that would fit behind the front wheel and not scrape the pavement. Problem solved.[/COLOR]
Curious as to where you are on this project progress?
[QUOTE=Bouncer;961775]I'd like to say possibly but I know it was driver abuse.[/QUOTE]
My riding buddy and I have been abusing our trikes for years (I feel so dirty coming out).
Seriously IMHO you can't hurt these belts but you can get a rock or screw in there to damage them.
On my buddies 2017 he has trashed two transmissions, the second one took the isolators with it also. The first tranny went when his bike was still stock, the second went after his motor was rebuilt to a 128ci. He now has been running a Grudge box tranny instead of Harley. Through all of that abuse to his bike his belt still looks like new.
I don't speed shift so I have salvaged my stock tranny and isolators. My motor is rebuilt to a 130ci (T-man plus Dark Horse bottom)
and I ride it hard. With 50,000 miles my belt is fine.
[QUOTE=Notgrownup;962539]Curious as to where you are on this project progress?[/QUOTE]
OK, I'm starting to think my shenanigans did not cause the drive belt failure.
I pulled her apart and removed the belt. Inspection went well. Everything other then the belt looked good. Upon close inspection I noticed no holes from debris, but the belt had more wear on one side like it was rubbing on side of the rear pulley. Not the whole length of the belt, just the spot were the teeth/cogs were missing. It wore so much, the remaining teeth/cogs in that spot had holes on the side like they were hollow teeth. I also noticed the remaining teeth/cogs were torn loose from the rub side. Not horizonal like you'd think do to torque.
So, I ordered parts, cleaned everything up and read the service manual instructions explaining adjustment and alignment. That's another story in itself the way HD explains that procedure !
Reassembly day comes. Swingarm goes back in and I bolt the rear end to that. The swingarm plate bolt holes are slotted. You are told to adjust the Fore-Aft first. They want it within a 1/16 of an inch.
You must have a laser line to do this. For the life of me I could not achieve this measurement. You take this measurement off the swingarm pivot shaft on each side. It was way off !
Here was the problem. My rear end was more then a 1/2 inch out of alignment from the adjustment screws. Right side was forward, left side was back. This now explained the wear on the right side of the drive belt.
I talked to my parts guy at HD and he stated when they set up a new Tri Glide, they do not check alignment of the rear end. It's supposed to be done at the HD assembly plant. The only thing they do back there is feel the belt tension.
I think this alinement was bad from day one. It had to be. Being a mechanic/machinist my whole life, I could see no one was fooling around back there. There weren't any witness marks to show that.
OK, Back to the alinement. So now I know I have to straighten the rear end so we have equal distance on the adjustment screws. This was no easy task. The rear end from being installed crooked did not want to sit straight anymore. I had to force it back with bars tightening the clamp bolts each time. Little by little it started to straighten out until I had equal adjustment on both sides.
Now, I went back to the Fore-Aft measurement. To my amazement I could now achieve the specifications HD called for and I tightened the rear end plates to the swingarm ! So, if you ever tackle a job like this, remember the rear end must be square first before Fore-Aft measurement. The HD service manual does not state this !
Next, adjust the belt tension. No explanation needed here, just adjust it back equally.
Now for the last hiccup ........ the belt was touching the battery box were it travels thru to the front pulley. I rechecked ALL my alinement measurements. Everything was perfect ! Back to the HD service manual we go, and lo and behold, they address this issue. HD service manual states, if the belt does not have enough clearance or is rubbing the battery box, move the Fore-Aft until the correct clearance is achieved.
I go thru all this meticulous laser measuring to achieve the absolute perfection the service manual wants, just to "move it over" till the belt clears the battery box !!! I shouldn't be surprised. I've found this to be the case throughout the years with other Harley specifications. You just have to let common sense guide you.
So that's that. I still don't have the body back on. I'm in no hurry. We don't have the weather to ride anyway. I'll let you guys know how the 32 tooth front pulley works out. Stay safe.
Yeah, taking your time is key. The alignment being off would put a big strain on the belt. Glad you caught the issue. If you would’ve just installed the new belt it would’ve done the same. These damn belt are nearly indestructible if the alignment is perfect.
good post very informative
[QUOTE=ISP-FL;962546]My riding buddy and I have been abusing our trikes for years (I feel so dirty coming out).
Seriously IMHO you can't hurt these belts but you can get a rock or screw in there to damage them.
On my buddies 2017 he has trashed two transmissions, the second one took the isolators with it also. The first tranny went when his bike was still stock, the second went after his motor was rebuilt to a 128ci. He now has been running a Grudge box tranny instead of Harley. Through all of that abuse to his bike his belt still looks like new.
I don't speed shift so I have salvaged my stock tranny and isolators. My motor is rebuilt to a 130ci (T-man plus Dark Horse bottom)
and I ride it hard. With 50,000 miles my belt is fine.[/QUOTE]
Thank you for this information !
I do like to twist the throttle a little.
I run Lucas 20w 50 HotRod oil in my primary. It has a high zinc content.
Reason being, the compensator ramps are metal on metal. A lot of bikes I've worked on with as low as 8,000 miles, always has some galling starting.
Mine has none ! The internals of the primary look like new.
Just a friendly FYI.
[QUOTE=Notgrownup;963171]Yeah, taking your time is key. The alignment being off would put a big strain on the belt. Glad you caught the issue. If you would’ve just installed the new belt it would’ve done the same. These damn belt are nearly indestructible if the alignment is perfect.[/QUOTE]
You know, with the axel alignment being that far off, you'd think you would feel that in the handling or see it on the rear tire wear. Nothing !
There was no indication while riding anything was wrong. You could let go of the bars and she'd go straight down the road.
Ever doing a wheelie, she'd pull up straight and run straight thru the intersection.
I'll bet there's gonna be at least a dozen people reading this, getting under their Tri Glide's and doing some measuring !
[QUOTE=Bouncer;963230]You know, with the axel alignment being that far off, you'd think you would feel that in the handling or see it on the rear tire wear. Nothing !
There was no indication while riding anything was wrong. You could let go of the bars and she'd go straight down the road.
Ever doing a wheelie, she'd pull up straight and run straight thru the intersection.
I'll bet there's gonna be at least a dozen people reading this, getting under their Tri Glide's and doing some measuring ![/QUOTE]
I probably will have the body off again sooner or later to re route my trailer wiring and to inspect and adjust my suspension. I will measure.
Hello again,
Well, she's all back together and running perfect. Since I had the body off, I flushed the front, rear and clutch Dot 4 fluid.
It only had 1% moisture content but the fluid was dark. Now everything is like new again !
The 32 tooth front transmission pulley is working out just like I thought it would.
When I slow down, I can tell by the speed and or engine sound what gear I need to be in for a smooth transition. Mostly because pretty much
all Harley's are configured close to the same drive ratio's. Even though they went from 4 to 5 then 6 speeds, they changed the primary and
final drive ratios too. This kept the bikes feeling "normal" per say for Harley anyway.
After I got this Tri Glide, I had to relearn what gear I needed to be in for that smooth transition. Didn't take long, but it was annoying at times
having been riding HD for 50 years. I looked like a greenhorn to those who didn't know me ! It was the RPM thing. I wasn't used to revving that high just to
downshift.
Then I'd jump back on a 2 wheeler and it felt like that old pair of worn out shoes you won't throw out because they are so natural feeling and comfortable.
Well, the 32 tooth front pulley gave me back that HD "normal feel". I don't have to skip 2nd and 4th anymore. It has a longer range in each gear without the engine sounding like it's revving all the time. The down shifting and transition is just like the 2 wheelers. Can't feel much of a power drop either. She'll do anything you need it to do.
I had to recalculate the speedometer pulse for the pulley change too.
Here's the recalculation formula but you must have a Power Vision or equivalent to do it.
Hold whatever speed you want and record the .......
Speedometer reading =
and the
GPS reading =
Now divide the speedometer reading by the GPS reading.
Then find the current pulse number in the Power Vision or equivalent.
Now X the current pulse number by the divided number you achieved earlier.
The new number is the new pulse number needed. Round it out to 4 digits.
So, thanks for reading this and I hope some of this gibberish makes sense and possibly helps someone down the line !