Anyone else?

Are the tubes swelled like to much pressure? Parts are crap today. I mounted a trans cooler looked very similar to that. Didn't even make it out of the garage before it started to leak.

No.

Neither one really look damaged. Which makes me think vibration.

This brand.

https://www.racereadyproducts.com/oil-coolers/long-stacked-plate-oil-coolers/

Its been maybe 15 years but I believe it was a Derale looked very similar to that. When we got into it I believe was supposed to be tested to 300 lbs. Trans cooler lines don't even come close to that. Those lines look like they could transmit vibration quite well being that short. I would expect a vibration failure to occur closer to the fittings. Not in the middle of the cooler. Vane pumps can cause peculiar vibrations in the line. But you have a gear pump. You have a rigidly mounted engine and the cooler is rigidly mounted as well. I can't see where it could vibrate enough to cause failure in that short of time. Maybe its time to try a different brand or style cooler.

Sidecarbill said:

Those lines look like they could transmit vibration quite well being that short. I would expect a vibration failure to occur closer to the fittings. Not in the middle of the cooler.

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I agree about the lines and length. The failure point is not that surprising if you consider the wall thickness of the input output tubing vs the wall thickness of the cross channel tubing. Resonance vibrations on the inlets could produce an up and down resonance vibration (more pronounced at the center of the span) in the cross channels.

If you can add a triangulating brace from the top cooler mount to one of the empty mounting holes on the regulator and another triangulating brace from the same cooler mounting hole to the far side lower cooler mount this should change the physical resonance of the system and hopefully fix the problem. These braces should attach to the cooler side of the vibration mounts not the frame side.

This trial and error approach could get expensive. Rex, I know you have access to some pretty slick equipment so what about attaching some strain gauges to different points on the assembly and watching the vibration waveforms with an oscilloscope through the rpm range (especially at typical cruising RPMs) while running on a dyno? you could test with and without the brackets or other solutions to compare the vibration waveforms.

Good luck chasing this gremlin!! (Devil)(Headbang)

any way to separate mount reg and cooler with a loop in the line? using 90 degree fittings on components or 90's on hose fittings can sometimes help set up a loop. That is, if the cause is vibration and not pressure spikes.

It will be interesting to see how it all works out. I lost my reply the other day, but basically I wondered about the stress at the higher RPM's when Rex is twisting the throttle a bit much.

Maybe lower RPM mellow operation is not as much of a stress on things as once you get up to higher RPM's.

I will follow to learn how all is resolved, hope mine works out, well so far it has..........

Well I do have strain guages and accelerometers. But rigging up and making 60k in electronics portable on a bike would be impractical and/or expensive.

I had just almost dry sumped the dang thing when I was modifying the oil system. I might move ahead with that idea. Looking at scavenger pumps and how I could rig one up. The cooler would be on the return lines instead of the pump pressure.

But for right now I am gonna whittle a billet cooler out and keep the system as is and see how it works out.

So Rex, were you able to get it fixed, or make your part for the temporary fix ?

DeathBySnuSnu said:

Well I do have strain guages and accelerometers. But rigging up and making 60k in electronics portable on a bike would be impractical and/or expensive.

Click to expand...

Not suggesting portable on bike. Just portable enough for set up at dyno location. Dyno time might be less expensive/destructive than trial and error. I'm thinking you will see a resonant frequency spike at some RPM range.

As you know, resonance can be very destructive: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacoma_Narrows_Bridge_(1940)

I have been busy lately.

Did the antique motorcycle show here in town.

Then the next weekend was the charity car show.

That was the last 2 weekends taken up.

The 2 weeks before that was all work.

So yes I made a bypass pipe and ran it to them two show weekends.

And no I have not made it any further on knowing why. A dyno that will fit the trike is few and far between in these parts. The time I had it on a dyno I had to wait for the mobile trailer to be within a day trip away. It will be late spring before the opportunity comes up again (the fall opportunity has passed). So yeah....I was up and gone at 2.30, unloading at 6 30, on the dyno by 7, off the dyno at 8, back home by noon. Which is about the time the girls are getting up and starting to move around and want things.

I did start on a billet cooler, but not far along with it.

I am hunting a reasonably small compact scavenger pump. If I can find what I want I might be dry sumping the thing and routing lines and locating the regulator differently.

just curious... if you go dry sump, does the reservoir become the oil cooler?

No....not exactly.

But could be sorta. Make the tank out of aluminum with some fins and mount it in the wind.

What I was thinking more about though was moving the blue regulator and a whole different hose set up. Mainly to get rid of the super short hose I am blaming for my troubles.

But.

I am still re thinking that. If I thought I needed to dry sump I would have done it before. So I do not believe I need to.....it is more of a convenience thing. I am now back to how to get some more length/flex to those lines. Not much room there for a pig tail of hose.

So still thinking about it. It always was fine before that blue regulator and making that hose so short.

So now I am making a billet cooler. I am sure it wont get rid of as much heat. But it will be tough enough it wont crack. I am gonna get it on it but it will be next summer before I actually know if it works well enough. I have made short around town trips 20 miles or less at a time with no cooler at all on it. It will take a highway run to heat soak it enough to need to cool the oil.

A bit early to visualize what it will be.

The through slots are done. Next will be all the blind slots.



Then all through holes drilled.

Just a thought. If you cut an internal thread (think rifling) to the cross tubes it might break up laminar flow and increase the cooling efficiency.

Will you be building the regulator into one of the cooler end caps so it isn't a lever arm to hang off the cooler and be a resonance source?

I did think the drill hole would be rougher. I may look into making it rougher to break it up.

As it stands with this first incarnation of the cooler

things will be nearly the same location and layout.

But the cooler being thicker metal vibrations probably will not hurt it. And then I also have enough meat to it to drill/tap a place for a supporting bracket for the regulator.

thinking of one down-side of going dry sump, would be partial loss of oil cooling already given by the finned metal crankcase that is in place.

you may be on the best track with the billet cooler. will stop breakage for sure.

Lotsa endmilling.

That cooler is still not complete.

Just off of it right now





I did dig this out of my junk pile and was wondering if I could fit it under there.

auxiliary sump?