Do you think Trikes are Safer than Bikes?

[The Wolf]

I am with you Angel. When my brakes failed 2 years ago, I was only saved due to having 3 wheels.:yes:

[Mattel]

<i><font color="SeaGreen">(This is a copy of my tech article for your comment. I placed this copy here on this thread in addition to the tech article section because we started this dialog and I wanted your comments.)</font></i><br /><br />
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Are Stallions Safe?<br /><br />
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I wanted to give my opinion on the safety of a Stallion. I would invite other Stallion owners to chime in with their experiences. <br /><br />
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I believe most if not all trikes are safer than motorcycles due to the additional wheel. Without motion, or a third load bearing device (i.e. kickstand or leg) all two wheel motorcycles will fall and subject themselves to damage. Even with motion, loss of traction of one wheel usually results in a fall and the amount of damage to motorcycle and driver depends on the velocity, density / abrasive qualities of the surface they come into contact with, along with a host of other mathematical calculations, and fortuitous luck or bad luck.<br /><br />
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I have ridden motorcycles, and in my opinion it is not a question of if you will drop your bike, it is a question of when. You must constantly be on guard, and it is a stress that is not present when riding a trike. I am sure you can test this for yourself, just ask all your friends that own motorcycles how many times they dropped, or laid down their motorcycle. Than compare it to the amount of times a triker rolls their rig.<br />
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This is not to say that motorcycles do not have an advantage in other areas, such as an ability to lean into turns, and some sport bikes can even take turns faster, or transverse uneven rugged terrain.

There are pros and cons to everything. <br /><br />
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When it comes to Trikes, I believe Stallions are one of the safer trikes <br /><br />
I am not aware of any safety data that compares trikes to motorcycles. If you are able to find any I would appreciate it. I believe all trikes are safer, and the insurance companies are able to charge us the same premium as our two wheeled brethren claiming they have no data to use to provide a discount. The arguments I have heard from some insurance companies allude to a common theme that crash data just lists the vehicle as a motorcycle, whether it is two or three wheels. I believe this is a weak argument, considering over 70% of all motorcycle crashes are one vehicle, they involve only the motorcycle. The insurance companies will have to face this issue in an honest manner during the next few years with the manufacture of whole trikes like the Stallion, T-Rex, V-13R, and the new Harley Davidson trike. These vehicles can be tracked and used as a comparison for claims against other two wheeled motorcycles.<br /><br />
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Although I do not believe we have any T-Rex or V-13R members, I do believe they are comparable or they may even excel above the Stallion in safety as well as price point. The T-Rex has a full roll bar cage, and I have seen videos of insane driving in an attempt to prove its safety.<br />
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The V-13R is just being introduced, and I do not believe there is enough information to form an opinion at this time.<br /><br />
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Let’s compare Stallion’s to other traditional trikes:<br /><br />
By traditional trikes I am talking about two wheeled motorcycles that are converted to trikes. Similar to the discussion above, I am just listing the pros and cons of safety, traditional trikes have pros over the Stallion's cons in safety or other areas, and I invite your comments in response.<br /><br />
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Stallions Safety Pros:<br /><br />
1.

Low center of gravity: <br /><br />
Stallions sit low to the ground. Take a look at the race car design when you lift the body off and you will see most of the steel frame just inches above the pavement. Wheelies are out of the question with the Stallion. With 155 h.p. the distribution of the weight makes wheelies impossible. When driving, you have to work hard to get one rear wheel to come off the ground, most of my attempts only resulted in chirps when taking banked sharp turns at high speeds. I was impressed when I hit patches of gravel in turns with little or no loss of traction.<br /><br />
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2. Super wide car tires:<br /><br />
There is no way around not seeing the amount of square inches of rubber sit on the ground.<br />
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The Stallion comes stock with supper wide car tires in the rear, and a front tire that is just as wide as any dark sider’s rear car tire I have ever seen on a Gold Wing.<br /><br />
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3. Good Daytime Visibility: <br /><br />
The Stallion’s size exceeds most traditional trikes, and comes standard with driving lights. Stallions are larger than a Smart Car, and are easy to see.

They may not have as much chrome as a traditional trike, but I would argue the unique large profile of the Stallion makes it easier to see during the day. <br /><br />
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4. Wedge like form / Wedge Metal frame:<br /><br />
The wedge design of the Stallion may allow it to be deflected off objects instead of crashing into them. This grazing will dissipate energy in a crash, reducing the amount of impact force. The Wedge design is not just in the exterior fiberglass, it extends into the sturdy metal tube frame. The wedge form is not a guarantee that a frontal crash like a tee bone will be avoided, but it means a higher percentage of crashes can be reduced due to the higher probability of deflecting he direction of the Stallion due to it’s shape, and the fact that the front wheel is not the first thing to come into contact in a crash.<br /><br />
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The heavy duty wedge metal frame also provide a substantial amount of protection from objects that extend into the ground like polls, trees, guard rails. In these situations it will be more likely that an off center hit will cause the Stallion to glance off the object instead of immediately stopping it.<br />
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In a crash the key is to dissipate energy as slowly as possible.<br /><br />
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5. Heavy fiberglass body:<br /><br />
As stated in the last section, the key to reduce injury is to dissipate energy. The 2008 and some 2009 Stallions have a heavy hand laid fiberglass body. This body can provide a substantial amount of protection during a crash, or from road debris or other road hazards.

The newer 2009 Stallions have a lighter plastic body that will also provide protection to the rider.<br /><br />
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6. Larger Body:<br /><br />
The large overall size of the Stallion provides a greater visibility than a motorcycle, and some smaller trikes, but it may be comparable to larger trikes that are in the same class. During the daytime, this large size leads to greater visibility, and at night the large car tail lights also work well. The large rear trunk, and all the metal under the body provide good protection from a rear end collision. A seat back is standard on the Stallion, and it will provide more protection by keeping the drive in control of the trike after impact. Side impact protection may vary depending on the height of the object or vehicle that is impacted.<br />
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The lower the better on the side of the Stallion, with object that are at ground level being the best.<br /><br />
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7. Lights:<br /><br />
The lights on the Stallion will offer protection in the form of visibility. The driving lights work in concert with the headlight to allow oncoming motorists to quickly identify you as a vehicle, day or night. The large car tail lights are bright and easily seen. The front headlights may be comparable to other trikes, and some custom trikes that are chock full of lights and LED’s may even surpass the stock Stallion in this area.

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8. Breaking:<br /><br />
Although the Stallion does not have anti-lock breaks, it does have four oversized disk breaks. The Stallion can stop on a dime. The large oversized tires provide a lot of traction during breaking, and if you lock up the breaks it does not drift to one side, it keeps a straight line. Abrupt emergency breaking on a two wheeled motorcycle is challenging, and can be disastrous for the novices.<br />
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I cannot compare breaking on other trikes, but most motorcycles that have been converted to trikes are utilizing the front breaking system that was designed for a lighter motorcycle.<br /><br />
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Traditional Trike Pros:<br /><br />
I cannot write this article without acknowledging traditional trikes have a higher seating position that allows them to see further ahead or over smaller vehicles. I also cannot leave out the fact that most traditional trikes have chrome, some of them have lots of chrome. Chrome has sparkle on sunny days, and that sparkle gets you noticed. There are too many different styles of traditional trikes to be able to make a definitive list of other good safety features they may have. Honda recently came out with an air bag for the Gold Wings, and many manufactures have anti-lock breaks. Finally, traditional trikes are often decked out with aftermarket lighting which increases visibility at night time.<br /><br />
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Conclusion:<br /><br />
I have listed out some of the reasons I believe the Stallions are safer than motorcycles and even some traditional trikes, but the largest factor of safety resides in the rider and the drivers of the vehicles that surround you every day.

No matter how safe you drive, you are at the mercy of the other drivers on the road. Please don’t confuse my intention of illustrating the safety aspects that I see on the Stallion with a belief that it is better than a traditional trike or motorcycle. Each and every vehicle has pros and cons, and some are a better fit than others. The key is to understand the pros and cons to decide which one is right for you.<br />
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No matter what you drive, drive safe and enjoy the ride!

[John Luciano]

Good one Mattel :good job: u can tel you have time on your hands <LOL> As far as rear tires : The conventional Trike , mine for instance has 225 X50 X16 Not sure what you call wide. Most trikes have 4 Disk brakes . all you other points are well noted .

[Yellow Trike]

I'm going to go out on a limb and sort of disagree.<br />
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I don't believe a trike is any safer than a 2-wheeler.<br />
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I don't believe a 2 wheels are any more dangerous than 3 wheels.<br />
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What I do believe is ANY vehicle driven on the edge of the DRIVER or RIDER's capabilities is unsafe.<br />
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Too many times, be it 2 or 3 wheels the OPERATOR is the cause of the vehicle being unsafe.<br />
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Yes, I love my trike. Yes, for me, the trike is safer.

[John Luciano]

Wow yes that is true. If u drive safely any bike, trike, CAR , BUS or even Unicycle is safe. Being a defensive driver and cautious etc.makes it safe. A 2 wheeler driven correctly can be as safe of safer than a trike. Example You are driving down a 2 lane back road you see 2 cars approaching you one passing the other . With the motorcycle you may have enough room to squeeze by on the shoulder with a car you are DEAD. With a trike you will most likely get sideswiped or hit.

[Mattel]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>John Luciano</strong>
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<div class="message">Good one Mattel :good job: u can tel you have time on your hands <LOL> As far as rear tires : The conventional Trike , mine for instance has 225 X50 X16 Not sure what you call wide. Most trikes have 4 Disk brakes . all you other points are well noted .</div>

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</div>John,<br />
Thanks for the info. But, my tires are bigger than your tires!<img src="images/smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0" alt="" title="blowing a raspberry" class="inlineimg" /> Just kidding, it's not the size that matters, its what you do with them!!!!:yes:

[ben721364]

Wide tires on a short wheelbase, narrow track, light weight vehicle present more negatives than positives in my opinion, hydroplaning being a major one, along with greater drag, etc.

[Mattel]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>ben721364</strong>
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<div class="message">Wide tires on a short wheelbase, narrow track, light weight vehicle present more negatives than positives in my opinion, hydroplaning being a major one, along with greater drag, etc.</div>

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</div>Ben,<br />
That is an interesting perspective. The Stallion has over 5 feet width, and it measures about 10 feet long. That is larger than a smart car and almost as long as some compact cars. I have rode in the rain at all different speeds and I don't think I ever had the sensation of hydroplaning. I have seen similar vehicles running at insane speeds in the rain without that happening. Check out this video on a similar vehicle similar to what you laid out above, with the exception that the single tire is on the rear:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHe5m1t_WTg" target="_blank">YouTube - T-Rex Tribike</a><br />
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I would also have to respectfully disagree with a greater drag, as even if you had greater drag from the tires, the pros of better traction would offset that 10-1.<br />
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I hope you all enjoyed that video, it was the one I mentioned in the article below.

[ben721364]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>Mattel</strong><br />
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<div class="message">Ben,<br /><br />
That is an interesting perspective. The Stallion has over 5 feet width, and it measures about 10 feet long. That is larger than a smart car and almost as long as some compact cars. I have rode in the rain at all different speeds and I don't think I ever had the sensation of hydroplaning. I have seen similar vehicles running at insane speeds in the rain without that happening. Check out this video on a similar vehicle similar to what you laid out above, with the exception that the single tire is on the rear:<br /><br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHe5m1t_WTg" target="_blank">YouTube - T-Rex Tribike</a><br /><br />
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I would also have to respectfully disagree with a greater drag, as even if you had greater drag from the tires, the pros of better traction would offset that 10-1.<br /><br />
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I hope you all enjoyed that video, it was the one I mentioned in the article below.</div><br />
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</div>I am on my third trike, including a Grinnall Scorpion 111, a K LT/Hannigan and my present GL18/Roadsmith. The range in weight from 850# to about 1150#. All but the Hannigan are equipped with wider tires than a Mazda Miata which weighs at least twice as much as the heaviest of the three. <br /><br />
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I was primarily speaking of aerodynamic drag, as you surmised. While I would agree that a wide sticky tire could provide greater traction than a similar but narrower tire on a drag race vehicle, I don't think that most trikes produce sufficient torque to take advantage of the wider stickier tread, especially on standing water.<br />
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I am glad that you haven't experienced hydroplaning.

It isn't much fun! <g><br /><br />
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I do recommend open tread designs for replacement trike tires. The more open, the better for channeling water out from under the tread.

[John Luciano]

Very Kool video. Only real difference he is doing 100+ MPH in a downpour. I have experienced Hydroplaning. I hit a pond in the middle of a highway doing 55 MPH . The front wheel had no problem as it is only 4" wide the rear 8" tires did quite a little dance.

[ben721364]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>John Luciano</strong>
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<div class="message">Very Kool video. Only real difference he is doing 100+ MPH in a downpour. I have experienced Hydroplaning. I hit a pond in the middle of a highway doing 55 MPH . The front wheel had no problem as it is only 4" wide the rear 8" tires did quite a little dance.</div>

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</div>Yup. That is precisely what I was trying to convey. You said it eloquently. <img src="images/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" class="inlineimg" />

[Mattel]

That make sense now. I have the BF Goodrich tires that have a good channel design. I will make sure I keep an eye out for large puddles.

[John Luciano]

Mattel It was not bad, it was over in 4 sec . I never feared for my life or anything like that.

[Boscoporp]

I am riding my second Trike. I feel a lot safer and have no doubt in my mind that those in boxes actually see me because of a modulating headlight. That in it self is a good enough reason to ride a Trike. If you remove all the accidents that take place because they don't see two-wheelers and it would be amazing how few accidents we are involved in. I realize that you can put modulating headlights on two wheelers but they don't! I have extra lights everywhere screaming "Look at Me!" "Look at me" Not scared I just don't want them to ruin my favorite possesion.

[Saltywheels]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>Yellow Trike</strong>
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<div class="message">I'm going to go out on a limb and sort of disagree.<br />
<br />
I don't believe a trike is any safer than a 2-wheeler.<br />
<br />
I don't believe a 2 wheels are any more dangerous than 3 wheels.<br />
<br />
What I do believe is ANY vehicle driven on the edge of the DRIVER or RIDER's capabilities is unsafe.<br />
<br />
Too many times, be it 2 or 3 wheels the OPERATOR is the cause of the vehicle being unsafe.<br />
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Yes, I love my trike. Yes, for me, the trike is safer.</div>

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</div>Even though I believe overall Trikes are safer, Yellow has read my mind. I have ridden / crashed - raced / not crashed since 1965. It is NEVER the machine; it's always the rider / driver. I believe I have never ridden as 'naturally' as I am currently doing, regardless of all the years of active track days. All my crashes were on the streets &amp; single vehicle incidents. You cannot ride on the street like you race on the track, even though track work hones your skill exponently. Look, I have just come to the Trike scene, but it is instantly apparent to me: Trikes are a lot more forgiving, in the context of riding. The 'oh S!@# moments are a lot easier to recover from....in case you ole time trikers have forgotten. Bottom line still is: You are only as safe as YOU ride.

[BlueTrinity]

Agreed. <br />
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As the saying goes; "There are only two kinds of riders. The ones who have laid their bikes down and the ones who have not laid their bikes down <b><i>yet</i></b>" <img src="images/smilies/grin.gif" border="0" alt="" title="big grin" class="inlineimg" />

[ben721364]

<b>"...I feel a lot safer and have no doubt in my mind that those in boxes actually see me <u>because of a modulating headlight</u>."</b> <br />
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Er. Modulators can be installed on and work on 2 wheelers as well as trikes...?<br />
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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>Boscoporp</strong>
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<div class="message">I am riding my second Trike. I feel a lot safer and have no doubt in my mind that those in boxes actually see me because of a modulating headlight. That in it self is a good enough reason to ride a Trike. If you remove all the accidents that take place because they don't see two-wheelers and it would be amazing how few accidents we are involved in. I realize that you can put modulating headlights on two wheelers but they don't! I have extra lights everywhere screaming "Look at Me!" "Look at me" Not scared I just don't want them to ruin my favorite possesion.</div>

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[FBTRIKE]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>BlueTrinity</strong>
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<div class="message">Agreed. <br />
<br />
As the saying goes; "There are only two kinds of riders. The ones who have laid their bikes down and the ones who have not laid their bikes down <b><i>yet</i></b>" <img src="images/smilies/grin.gif" border="0" alt="" title="big grin" class="inlineimg" /></div>

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</div>I have to disagree....:no: I rode two wheels for almost 40 years, never laid one down and I never will! Of course thats because I'm on a trike now. And now that I am, I might TIP ONE OVER!:eek: But I don't think I'll ever lay one down........<img src="images/smilies/grin.gif" border="0" alt="" title="big grin" class="inlineimg" />

[BIG AL]

Asking if a trike is safer than a bike would be like asking if a rifle is safer than a hand gun , trikes do have limitations especially width wise there are several evasive moves you can do on a bike that you couldnt do on a trike,it also depends on who is in control of the trike , how much road time on a trike or bike matters, not being over confident just beacause you think its safer because of that third wheel ,For me a trike is safer 1-better seen from the rear 2-wife feels safer 3-more stable on rough roads ,it only takes one idot to ruin your day no matter which one you are on ,being alert and always knowing whats around you is always a good way to be safe always have a way out ,we all have our own technique for riding Be Safe :yes:

[ben721364]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>BIG AL</strong>
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<div class="message">Asking if a trike is safer than a bike would be like asking if a rifle is safer than a hand gun , trikes do have limitations especially width wise there are several evasive moves you can do on a bike that you couldnt do on a trike,<b>it also depends on who is in control of the trike</b> , how much road time on a trike or bike matters, not being over confident just beacause you think its safer because of that third wheel ,For me a trike is safer 1-better seen from the rear 2-wife feels safer 3-more stable on rough roads ,it only takes one idot to ruin your day no matter which one you are on ,being alert and always knowing whats around you is always a good way to be safe always have a way out ,we all have our own technique for riding <img src="images/smilies/cool.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Cool" class="inlineimg" /> Be Safe :yes:</div>

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</div>"it also depends on who is in control of the trike,..." True enough but this applies equally to a motorcycle.