Harley Fluids What and Why!

[msocko3]

What is a compensator?

The compensator is the front drive sprocket on crankshaft of the engine, it has ramps and a spring pack which works to dampen pulses and sudden shock to the crankshaft. Here is a picture of a completely assembled compensator, the spring is actually stacked disk which look like cupped washers.

[msocko3]

Iv always used castrol Syntec 5-50 engine, Hd primary formula +, redline trans.

Formula+ is the primary fluid which seems to help the compensator live a longer life.

[rossn2]

2008 Road King, 2011 Electra Glide Limited, 2013 Tri Glide..


At 1000 miles service:

Amsoil, Schaffer Supreme 7000, or Redline 20w-50 in engine (unless summer time and goin on trip then it's straight Amsoil 60w)
Amsoil 75w-110 Severe Gear in Tranny
Amsoil 20w-50, Schaffers 20w-50 (7000 series), Valvoline 20w-50 (conventional motorcycle oil-black bottle) or Redline MTL in Primary. Never any clutch slippage issues on any bike..

And all oils are changed every 5k miles...

[hazy]

Was just reading through this oil thread and came on some questions and comments about measuring the oil level on trikes with the dipstick. Evidently, if you have the dual markings you're fine. If you don't, try this - It'll work for any make model or year. Find out the tranny fluid capacity from your service manual. You do have a service manual right? Drain trans. Fill trans with the specified amount of fluid. Measure level with dipstick. Mark dipstick (a little scribe with a hacksaw blade will work) . Now you know what the proper level is.

[Sloufoot]

2008 Road King, 2011 Electra Glide Limited, 2013 Tri Glide..


At 1000 miles service:

Amsoil, Schaffer Supreme 7000, or Redline 20w-50 in engine (unless summer time and goin on trip then it's straight Amsoil 60w)
Amsoil 75w-110 Severe Gear in Tranny
Amsoil 20w-50, Schaffers 20w-50 (7000 series), Valvoline 20w-50 (conventional motorcycle oil-black bottle) or Redline MTL in Primary. Never any clutch slippage issues on any bike..

And all oils are changed every 5k miles...

I'm also an Amsoil believer ! I have seen a lot of oils fail, but never an Amsoil product. That could happen tomorrow.... Their might be better oils, but none that I have seen that will pass all the different tests. They might excel at one thing, but fail at others. Remember a bearing, ball or roller that is running in oil submerged all the time only gets lubricated by microscopic droplets of oil while turning. The only time the Brg might be flooded is if oil pressure forces the oil through. So it takes an oil that will stay attached so to speak to the moving bearing parts even while hot.
Caterpillar uses one oil in all their gear boxes, Trans, & Engine. Including their Hydraulic system, & Automatic Trans. Their oil in differentials might differ from machine to machine, but not the rest.
I know, that isn't a motorcycle, but just as an example of one oil for everything. And running a lot higher pressures than bikes.

Just my 2c.............
Ride Safe All !

[Craigar]

2008 Road King, 2011 Electra Glide Limited, 2013 Tri Glide..


At 1000 miles service:

Amsoil, Schaffer Supreme 7000, or Redline 20w-50 in engine (unless summer time and goin on trip then it's straight Amsoil 60w)
Amsoil 75w-110 Severe Gear in Tranny
Amsoil 20w-50, Schaffers 20w-50 (7000 series), Valvoline 20w-50 (conventional motorcycle oil-black bottle) or Redline MTL in Primary. Never any clutch slippage issues on any bike..

And all oils are changed every 5k miles...

Why not Amsoil ATF in Primary?

[Salty]

A soil 20/50 and 75/90 in the gear box

Amsoil

[Sloufoot]

Why not Amsoil ATF in Primary?

I don't think the ATF meets the specs for the clutches in Harley. Amsoil has a list ov all their oils that you can use & where.

[msocko3]

Why not Amsoil ATF in Primary?

All Triglides and 2011 and later 2 wheel touring come with the Screamin Eagle compensator which is very sensitive to the type of lubricant used. Using an ATF is a quick way of killing it, the only lubricant that gives somewhat of a longer life is Formula+.

[GARYD]

I am an Amsoil user - have been for over 20 years. Because I think it has the best additive package, the price is reasonably cheap and it's readily available.
I'm not knocking any other name brand oil, they are also good. I have not heard of any oil failing to do it's job when changed at the correct intervals.

Would I change brands? Of course if I had to - I've got nothing against other oils - back in the day I used just about every brand oil there was - never had a problem with them either.

I like syn oil because I don't want to be changing oil every couple months.

In the long run syn is as cheap if not cheaper then dino oil.

[rossn2]

the only lubricant that gives somewhat of a longer life is Formula+.

Why does MOCO recommend 20w-50 SYN3 in all three holes if the quote is true?

My bike has close to 800 miles now, gonna take it in tomorrow and have the 1k service done. It will get
Amsoil 20w-50 engine, 75w-110 Severe Gear in Tranny, and probably Schaeffers Supreme 7000 20w-50 in primary, haven't decided..have to look and see what is on the shelf at home

[msocko3]

Why does MOCO recommend 20w-50 SYN3 in all three holes if the quote is true?

My bike has close to 800 miles now, gonna take it in tomorrow and have the 1k service done. It will get
Amsoil 20w-50 engine, 75w-110 Severe Gear in Tranny, and probably Schaeffers Supreme 7000 20w-50 in primary, haven't decided..have to look and see what is on the shelf at home

There are a lot of things which happen behind the scenes at the MoCo that folks don't know. The same oil in all 3 holes is just something to sell Syn3, I won't put a motor oil in my transmission. I tried it and found it came out of the transmission like water when hot and I used to get a lot of metal fuzz on the drain plug magnet. I switched to Red Line Shockproof heavy and never had any more metal fuzz on my drain plug, plus it looked a heck of a lot more substantial than water coming out when its hot.

The reason behind Formula+ helping it to live longer is experience of some guys on Harley Tech Talk. There is a couple of sharp minded guys when it comes to metals and oil who have done some testing. They have found the weakness in the compensator design and identified the oil which seems to help it survive longer.

My dads compensator was shot at 36,000 miles, the compensator in the 2010 Triglide I owned was shot at 22,000 miles. You can tell a bad compensator by either the clang or clunk it makes when you shut the engine off. Or it will have a rattle in the primary area, and sometimes pick up a vibration in the 2,500 - 3,000 rpm range. Only a hand full will vibrate, most clang or clunk.

[White Knight 04]

I use Mobil 1 20 / 50 Vtwin in all 3 holes and have been using it for many many years now with no problems !!!!

[IBTRIKED]

I'm running Harley's Syn 3 in everything on my '06 Ultra. It is a bit pricy, but I like the idea of only having to carry one bottle of oil when out on the road that will cover "all 3 holes". Yes, I have had to add oil to the trans when out on the road. Now that she's a trike, I probably won't ever have to do that again, but I plan to keep using the Syn 3. According to some people, that are using Amsoil, the Amsoil gear lube helps quiet that clunk in the trans when going from neutral to 1st, but then too, plain old 90 wt gear oil would probably do that too. I know when I get that Syn 3 on my hands it's almost impossible to wipe off that slipery feeling without soap or handcleaner. It feels a LOT like Type E fork oil in that respect.

NM

Like Amsoil for tran. first gear no longer sounds like breaking glass. I also dont slip by N as much. But like you say any 90# might do that cheaper. Ride like Ya STOLE it, Ray

[GARYD]

I still say 3 different applications = 3 different oils.

Would you paint your car with house paint? Or paint the outside of your house with interior paint?

And why buy oil supplied by the lowest bidder when you can get a much better oil, cheaper, from Amsoil, Red Line, QS, Pensoil, Mobil1, Valvoline or any other brand name mfg?

[Sloufoot]

I still say 3 different applications = 3 different oils.

Would you paint your car with house paint? Or paint the outside of your house with interior paint?

And why buy oil supplied by the lowest bidder when you can get a much better oil, cheaper, from Amsoil, Red Line, QS, Pensoil, Mobil1, Valvoline or any other brand name mfg?

Then answer how company's like Caterpillar just for instance. There are others,, use series 3 engine oil in all their gear boxes, Hydraulic sys., engines, planitaries, chain drives, automatic transmissions, & differentials.......? Not to sell parts,,,They rent or lease much of their inventory. So they also have to pay the bill...
I also know of people that run nothing but 10w, S3 oil in everything (Heavy equipment). With few if any failures. None oil related. But they keep the temps within a safe range. Not like Harley's 300*+ engine oil !
Sometimes a thinner lubricant can get into places while running that a heavier oil can't. If the lubricity of the oil is retained, & isn't forced from between wear surfaces, they could be a better choice. You need to see a bearing running at high speed under oil. It is an amazing insight !
Saying that,,,,, I do run Amsoil 75/140 in the transmission mainly for the quieter gear noise, & the temps it hits.
I guess it really is a personal choice, as long as it meets the correct specs.....KNOW YOUR OIL SPECS !!!

[arnie]

Sloufoot,when i worked there we used different oil in different cavities,but that was 6yrs ago.I worked in the factory,not at a dealership.

[Sloufoot]

Sloufoot,when i worked there we used different oil in different cavities,but that was 6yrs ago.I worked in the factory,not at a dealership.

I know all the equipment we received from Cat were recommended all the same oils. The only difference was a few models were the differentials.
I can't remember how far back that went, but it seems like more than 6 yrs. In fact I know the trans & hyd. goes back many years. All of our 966 & 988 loaders did, and our D8K'S & D8H'S did. Among others....

[arnie]

Yea i have no idea what they recommended.When i worked the ass.line we put in the amount that was called for,sent it to test,then drained,or shipped with oil,depending on what the customer wanted.All the drained oil was filtered(perse) & sent back to the ass. line.I used to install & test marine gears,they had a special oil for them that was located in 55gal drums.I just worked in the engine division,haven't a clue about dozers or any other piece of equipment.When i used to stall build some of the engines we were told to take the fram stickers off of any filter we were installing & put on the companys sticker.It was they said a condition of employment.I have seen enough over the yrs to know that what the factory recommends doesn't mean it's a good thing.Any trucks,motorcycles,any gasoline product i purchase,the first thing i do is dump the oil & put in what i think is best.I'm not saying everybody has the same process that i had seen,but they are all to save a buck.So that is why i use different oils in different cavities.

[GARYD]

I still say 3 different applications = 3 different oils.

Would you paint your car with house paint? Or paint the outside of your house with interior paint?

And why buy oil supplied by the lowest bidder when you can get a much better oil, cheaper, from Amsoil, Red Line, QS, Pensoil, Mobil1, Valvoline or any other brand name mfg?

That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

Amsoil is still cheaper then H-D Syn3 and a much better oil.....in my opinion.