SVDA distributor help

[starrider1946]

Installed my SVDA distirbutor. Doing something wrong but don't know what. This is what I did. Pulled the right valve cover off. Rolled the motor over until both valves were closed and my degree wheel was on top dead center. With my old distributor the rotor was pointing at the number one cylinder. When I pulled the distributor I looked at the bottom to see what position it was in. The tabs were not pointing straight forward but the rotor was pointing to the one cylinder. When I took the new distributor and put the tabs on the bottom in the same position it was pointing to the number two cylinder.

I installed it and moved number one to the number two and so forth. Thought that would work but it didn't. I moved the timing back and forth but it is out of time to my ear. I don't have any way of moving the gear down in the motor, in fact i can 't even see. Am I correct in saying there is only one way the distributor will fit? Also is there a way to move the distributor drive shaft in the car. Mine is not perpendicular to the crankshaft sea like it should be. Can I use the distributor with it like that? I am under the understanding that if I put the distributor in and the rotor points to number two I use it as number one. I think Ijust said that above. Anywwy I need help. Thanks

[Sidecarbill]

Far as i know goes one way.are u confusing number 1&2 cylinder? One is pass side front.Wiht the distriuter out the slot should b about paralell with crank pulley.short side toward pulley,i believe.Make sure distrubuter is engaged in slot same with rotor.Vacum advance sort of positioned to back of motor.

[starrider1946]

Thanks Bill. I think I've got one and to down. I went awhile ago and took the valve cover of again and reestablished top dead center. I have both valves closed with my pulley on top dead center and the rotor is pointed at the number one spark plug wire and the piston feels all the way up with a stiff piece of wire. I don't know what else to do on that part. Seems like the new distributor should slide right in and be right. But like I said when I put it in the rotor pointed to the number two plug wire instead of the number one. I'll try again tomorrow.

Far as i know goes one way.are u confusing number 1&2 cylinder? One is pass side front.Wiht the distriuter out the slot should b about paralell with crank pulley.short side toward pulley,i believe.Make sure distrubuter is engaged in slot same with rotor.Vacum advance sort of positioned to back of motor.

[Sidecarbill]

Sorry brainfart yes thats what mine did and I just rotated the wires.If u moved the wires in the right order should run.have someone crank the engine while u rotate the distributer.

[stinger608]

If you look at this page:

http://www.vw-resource.com/longblock.html

And scroll about 2/3rds of the way down the page, you will see a drawing picture with the caption "Slot in the Distributor Driveshaft

Just below the picture. This is what the driveshaft should look like in the #1 TDC position.

As you probably know at this point, the distributor will only fit in one way. If the rotor is pointing in a completely different position than the original distributor that you pulled out, I would be hesitant in trusting said distributor.

However, if its okay then yes, you can rotate your wires one place on the cap in either direction. Shouldn't make any difference as far as something going wrong.

[starrider1946]

It seems like to me that if the distributor that is in there now points to the number one cylinder at top dead center that the new one should also when I put it in but it doesn't. This distributor is supposed to work with a type 1 motor.I don't know how to explain this but I'll try. If you hold the two distributors side by side from top to bottom the position of the rotors and tabs on bottom don't match each other. I guess that is why when I put the new one in it points to number two. Is it possible this distributor is for a different motor? I bought it online. Maybe I can find out who makes it and give them a call. I thought that I could move the wires using number 2 as number 1 and so forth. I'll keep trying. Thanks for the info.

If you look at this page:

http://www.vw-resource.com/longblock.html

And scroll about 2/3rds of the way down the page, you will see a drawing picture with the caption "Slot in the Distributor Driveshaft


Just below the picture. This is what the driveshaft should look like in the #1 TDC position.

As you probably know at this point, the distributor will only fit in one way. If the rotor is pointing in a completely different position than the original distributor that you pulled out, I would be hesitant in trusting said distributor.

However, if its okay then yes, you can rotate your wires one place on the cap in either direction. Shouldn't make any difference as far as something going wrong.

[stinger608]

It seems like to me that if the distributor that is in there now points to the number one cylinder at top dead center that the new one should also when I put it in but it doesn't. This distributor is supposed to work with a type 1 motor.I don't know how to explain this but I'll try. If you hold the two distributors side by side from top to bottom the position of the rotors and tabs on bottom don't match each other. I guess that is why when I put the new one in it points to number two. Is it possible this distributor is for a different motor? I bought it online. Maybe I can find out who makes it and give them a call. I thought that I could move the wires using number 2 as number 1 and so forth. I'll keep trying. Thanks for the info.

Yes Starrider, your assumption should be very correct. Both should be identical as far as the drive position and rotor position. That does concern me to the quality of the new distributor.

In reality it shouldn't matter all that much as to where the rotor points as long as there is enough movement in the distributor to allow for proper timing. It could essentially point to number 3 cylinder and it wouldn't really matter. Of course the plug wires would have to be arranged differently but in essence it would still work.

I am wondering if the new distributor was made to accommodate the type 1 and type 3 applications. Even though the original type 3 used the same basic design as the type 1's. If I remember correctly though, in the early 70's versions they did in fact position the rotor a bit different. This was to compensate for the electronic fuel injection parts that would be in the way of the normal type 1 vacuum diaphragm.

It should still work just fine though......Giving that you are able to move the distributor enough to allow for proper timing.

[Rsw]

My 009 clone does not line up like the Bosch 034. I just held the timing light on it till it was close and moved the plug wires so they wasn't in a bind. The two mistakes I made was to run the plug wires backwards from the way the motor runs and flooded it so bad that I had to pull the plugs to dry it out. Once I got the timing close and the motor to fire, it took a while to clear the motor of the unburnt gas.

[starrider1946]

Thanks Stinger. The distributor is a Hot-Spark. Bought it off ebay ( item # 311393598961) It is supposed to be able to be used on a type 1,2,3,4 and Porsche motors. I read a little about the distributor on Samba. Some people liked it some didn't. I guess maybe a type three rotor did point different than type 1 or something. Just talked to the people who make the distributor. Told him that when I installed the distributor with the motor at TDC the rotor points at number 2 cylinder when installed. He said what you said that it should work if I can move the distributor enough to time it. He said something was different about the rotor position from the 009 and the older Volks distributors. It should work.
I'll check to make sure I have the plug wires right Rsw.
I've got to read how to use my strobe light without the motor running to get the timing close. Never did that. I'll keep you posted.

My 009 clone does not line up like the Bosch 034. I just held the timing light on it till it was close and moved the plug wires so they wasn't in a bind. The two mistakes I made was to run the plug wires backwards from the way the motor runs and flooded it so bad that I had to pull the plugs to dry it out. Once I got the timing close and the motor to fire, it took a while to clear the motor of the unburnt gas.

[Rsw]

[vwbug72501]

Been a while since I built a motor but if I remember correctly, if you're not careful when installing the distributor drive gear, you could get it 1 or 2 teeth off from the correct position. (Not that late hours or mass quantities of adult beverages had anything to do with it.) Pulling out the drive gear once installed takes a special puller and you will most likely drop the little washers that are installed under the drive gear into the case. We used to just "adjust" the distributor location / plug wire location to get the engine to run. Our engines were thoroughly abused running the sand bars on the Mississippi so they were usually torn down within a few months.

you can put a piece of cigarette pack cellophane between your points and set TDC on #1 cylinder. Set the plug wires to the appropriate holes. Pull gently on the cellophane and rotate the distributor slowly until the cellophane just pulls. Put the cap on the distributor. That should get you close enough to start the engine

[Loner]

Drive Gear Removal Tool, Gear Slot Alignment for #1, Dist Drive Gear Components


The distributor drive gear is not perpendicular to the motor case. Check the steps I outlined in a previous post (ref: 34pict flat spot):

"The distributor anti-chatter spring looks like and is slightly larger than a ballpoint ink pen spring. It goes in the hole in the center of the distributor drive gear under the distributor and keeps a tension on the drivetrain. It is probably the most lost part to a VW motor and many just install the distributor without it. They are about $3 if you can find one. If you have to order one, I'd recommend going ahead and install the distributor without it and install it when it arrives. You likely will not see any noticeable firing problems as the spring generally comes into play at higher revolutions when you are on and off the throttle.

As to drive gear alignment, with the engine at TDC for #1 (fire point) the drive gear slot should be perpendicular to the crankcase seam (running parallel to the rear pulley) and slightly offset toward the rear pulley. If that's what you see, then you are good to go."

If the dirve gears slot is in the proper position with engine at TDC (slot in drive gear parallel with rear pulley and slightly offset toward that pulley), then install the distributor with the slot properly engaged with the distributor gear. #1 spark plug wire will be where the rotor tells you it is (no matter where it used to be). Aim the rotor and the #1 wire as directly as you can. I've worked with engines (mostly VW) for over 50 years and I do not know a trick to static timing a solid state ignition. Maybe there is one, and if so I'd love to be enlightened by some of our tech guys here.

I know you know it very well by know, but firing order is 1234 counterclockwise or 1432 clockwise from #1.

[starrider1946]

I believe the gear drive is in the right place. I think it is the distributor itself. The rotor points more to the left than the one that is in there. I am going to reinstall it an d move the plug wires probably using the number two position as number one. I don't about the timing. I will just have to fool with it. I wish I would have just bought a standard vw distributor with points and condensor. I think I would have been better off. I'll keep trying. Thanks for the help.

Drive Gear Removal Tool, Gear Slot Alignment for #1, Dist Drive Gear Components


The distributor drive gear is not perpendicular to the motor case. Check the steps I outlined in a previous post (ref: 34pict flat spot):

"The distributor anti-chatter spring looks like and is slightly larger than a ballpoint ink pen spring. It goes in the hole in the center of the distributor drive gear under the distributor and keeps a tension on the drivetrain. It is probably the most lost part to a VW motor and many just install the distributor without it. They are about $3 if you can find one. If you have to order one, I'd recommend going ahead and install the distributor without it and install it when it arrives. You likely will not see any noticeable firing problems as the spring generally comes into play at higher revolutions when you are on and off the throttle.

As to drive gear alignment, with the engine at TDC for #1 (fire point) the drive gear slot should be perpendicular to the crankcase seam (running parallel to the rear pulley) and slightly offset toward the rear pulley. If that's what you see, then you are good to go."

If the dirve gears slot is in the proper position with engine at TDC (slot in drive gear parallel with rear pulley and slightly offset toward that pulley), then install the distributor with the slot properly engaged with the distributor gear. #1 spark plug wire will be where the rotor tells you it is (no matter where it used to be). Aim the rotor and the #1 wire as directly as you can. I've worked with engines (mostly VW) for over 50 years and I do not know a trick to static timing a solid state ignition. Maybe there is one, and if so I'd love to be enlightened by some of our tech guys here.

I know you know it very well by know, but firing order is 1234 counterclockwise or 1432 clockwise from #1.

[Rsw]

I never gave any thought to it being electronic ignition when I posted the videos. Sorry about that

[starrider1946]

NO problem n the electronic ignition. Like I said in the post above I almost wish I would have went with points and condenser.

I never gave any thought to it being electronic ignition when I posted the videos. Sorry about that

[starrider1946]

Well I put the SVDA distributor back in and new blue coil back on. The rotor pointed to the number two wire so I used it as number one and put the rest of the wires on. I am running a vacuum line from both carburetors so I plugged them. Hooked up my timing light and turned the distributor more towards the fuel pump and got my wife to start the motor. It started right up ( Thank the Lord) I set the timing to 7 or eight degree's BTDC. When I revved the motor it is about 30 degrees. I took it out for a ride and it is much much better. Still has a faint stumble after shifting but all in all it is better. I was wondering if I should advance or retard the timing a little and see what happens and if it would help. Thanks

NO problem n the electronic ignition. Like I said in the post above I almost wish I would have went with points and condenser.

[Loner]

In fine tuning with timing, I have found no set rule as to advance or retard to improve performance. General rules say don't advance beyond 30-32 degrees at 3000RPM, so a bit retard might help. I've always found that implementing some retard into a project always helps and makes for something to laugh at (and it's usually me). [The last line is a joke - not a good one, but a joke just the same]

[starrider1946]

Sounds good to me. I figure I'll try a little one way then the other. I'll retard it a little first and try that. It is real close. I am with you on the 30-32 degrees at 3000 RPM from what I can read. Thanks for all the help Loner.

In fine tuning with timing, I have found no set rule as to advance or retard to improve performance. General rules say don't advance beyond 30-32 degrees at 3000RPM, so a bit retard might help. I've always found that implementing some retard into a project always helps and makes for something to laugh at (and it's usually me). [The last line is a joke - not a good one, but a joke just the same]

[starrider1946]

Back again. I retarded the timing a little and tired that but didn't seem to help. Right now I have it on 8 degrees advanced with vacuum lines plugged and looks like 30 degrees at about 3000rpm. I tried it al little retarded and a little advanced. Didn't seem to make any difference.
It seems to have problems in the 1200 to 1600 rpm range. I have had different sets of carbs and two different distributors and it has had this stumble or miss or whatever I need to call it with both. I have checked to make sure there is no intake leak and there are none. The valves are adjusted. The carbs are adjusted to the best of my ability and the carbs are in sync. I am attempting to find a good vw mechanic and get this thing straightened out but I would like any suggestions.

Sounds good to me. I figure I'll try a little one way then the other. I'll retard it a little first and try that. It is real close. I am with you on the 30-32 degrees at 3000 RPM from what I can read. Thanks for all the help Loner.

[Sidecarbill]

Same experience for me. spent a lot of money on distributer and carbs, didn'realy help much. I could jet it out but couldn't deal with 20mpg. Single carb 4 me.I'm not sure duals would change much. As I said carb heat and all cooling tins helped the most.Love my vdub,no performance,no fuel mileage,the best of both worlds.