Didn't someone start a tread on here about

[Rollin Thunder]

I've been reading PRO"S & CON"S about taking the cat out of the head pipes on the Newer HD"s. I thought someone had posted pics on this about a year ago and how to do it. Some say yeah go for it. It really works well getting rid of the heat on the right side. Other's say save your $$$$ over a grand if the dealer does it. And all you need is longer floorboards ?? I"D SERIOUSLY would like some HONEST answers on this. I have a friends head pipes which he took off his 14. If all I have to do is cut out the cat and re install them. OH HELL Yeah !! Now there should also be 2 cat's ? one in each head pipes ? HELP :xzqxz:............Thanks Rick

 

[Gorilla]

The cat is in the section where the 2 pipes first come together, just to the rear of the O2 sensors. If you all ready have another stock header pipe go for it. You cut open the section where the cat is scrape the metal out and weld the piece back on.

 

[gerald martin]

cat removal

1. Get a laser heat gun or rent one
2. Find some one with the cat removed
3.Find some one with the cat still in
4. have both bikes ride the same distance at the same time for at least 20 miles
5. Take temps on both bikes rear head temp by the spark plug front head temp by the spark plug. rear exhaust pipe up close to the head, front exhaust pipe up close to the head, rear exhaust pipe about 4 inches from the top on both bikes.
I have done this on quite a few bikes in my club. I found as I am sure you will find the temps are close to identical. leave the cat in. If you want to cool your bike try running two oil coolers

 

[Gorilla]

Gerald Did you take the temp where the cat is/was? This location is where people complain they get heat on their right foot towards the rear. All the places you dictate are before the cat location. The cat itself creates heat. Removing the cat is not suggested as a means to cool the engine itself because it will not. What it does do is remove some heat in the area of where the cat was located and after it.

 

[rhino 2]

1. Get a laser heat gun or rent one
2. Find some one with the cat removed
3.Find some one with the cat still in
4. have both bikes ride the same distance at the same time for at least 20 miles
5. Take temps on both bikes rear head temp by the spark plug front head temp by the spark plug. rear exhaust pipe up close to the head, front exhaust pipe up close to the head, rear exhaust pipe about 4 inches from the top on both bikes.
I have done this on quite a few bikes in my club. I found as I am sure you will find the temps are close to identical. leave the cat in. If you want to cool your bike try running two oil coolers

Find a trike with the cat removed, and one with the cat still intact, Then put the temperature sensor ''At''the spot where the cat is, And then the spot where the cat was...Then i think your results will differ..
Removing the cat will take the heat off the riders right ankle... Thats the main reason to remove it.. It has very little to cooling the engine or the exhaust...

 

[gerald martin]

cat removal

I forgot to put to check the temp right before, right in the middle of the cat and right behind the cat. the temps were almost identical on my testing. I did my testing on a warm day about 80 f we were on a day trip which covered over two hundred miles and I took readings approximately every 50 miles. Also if you take a air volume tester (hard to find unless you work for the gas company or on a gas pipeline) I am sure you could rent one you will find the cat has almost no restriction over a non cat pipe. These are my findings. You don't have to believe me but if you don't, take the time and effort to test yourself. Removing the cat may make a difference on a extremely high performance motor with sophisticated tuners that only a few would know how to use but for the average person with a mildly hopped up or stock engine my testing shows leaving the cat in is probably your best bet. of course all the manufacturers say their non cat pipe are best but you have to realize they are in it to sell and make money. If you took almost any motor cycle magazine and bought every thing advertised in it to increase power, cool your motor and increase your gas mileage you would have a bike with hundreds of horsepower run so cool it would keep you beer cool and you would get 1000 miles per gallon

 

[msocko3]

I forgot to put to check the temp right before, right in the middle of the cat and right behind the cat. the temps were almost identical on my testing. I did my testing on a warm day about 80 f we were on a day trip which covered over two hundred miles and I took readings approximately every 50 miles. Also if you take a air volume tester (hard to find unless you work for the gas company or on a gas pipeline) I am sure you could rent one you will find the cat has almost no restriction over a non cat pipe. These are my findings. You don't have to believe me but if you don't, take the time and effort to test yourself. Removing the cat may make a difference on a extremely high performance motor with sophisticated tuners that only a few would know how to use but for the average person with a mildly hopped up or stock engine my testing shows leaving the cat in is probably your best bet. of course all the manufacturers say their non cat pipe are best but you have to realize they are in it to sell and make money. If you took almost any motor cycle magazine and bought every thing advertised in it to increase power, cool your motor and increase your gas mileage you would have a bike with hundreds of horsepower run so cool it would keep you beer cool and you would get 1000 miles per gallon

DO the same test with both bikes being tuned for optimum power and fuel mileage, you'll find the cat equipped bike will be hotter in the cat area vs the no cat. The richer AFR will cause a greater reaction in the catalyst which creates more heat, upwards of 1,000 degrees and could reach considerably greater than 1,000 depending on how rich the AFR is. Exhaust gas is the hottest within the first 6" exit of the exhaust valve, of course things such as rpm and timing can rise the temp and also increase the temp farther down stream.

I can tell you the non cat exhaust on my 120" engine is considerably cooler than the cat equipped exhaust I had on the 2010 Triglide I used to own. This is an engine which makes 136ft/lbs of torque and gets 41mpg when ridden sane.

 

[rhino 2]

Did test it myself, Took the cat out and now i don't have to move my foot to keep my ankle from burning... Also the reason theres a thermostat on the oil cooler ' And on water cooled engines is to keep the engine and oil at a certain operating temp, Too cold and efficiency drops tremendously ..As does longevity..

 

[screwball]

The exhaust pipe will not get any hotter than the exhaust gas that passes through. The catalyst will retain heat after the motor is shut off, but it won't get any hotter. IF all you do is remove the cat, the engine will run leaner because the system is more free flowing. A leaner engine will run HOTTER, so you will probably need a tuner of some sort.


I have installed floorboard extensions on all 4 of our trikes. We have no problem with the heat. Like you, we live on the Mojave Desert in So. Cal. where it gets really HOT in the summer. You can see in my siggy picture I wear shorts a lot. Last time I burned my calf was on my Ultra getting off on the wrong side and put my leg on the exhaust pipe.


Good Luck, and enjoy that trike. Oh, take a look at a "wet vest" for the summer. Really helps keep YOU cool when riding in the summer heat.

 

[DK Custom Products]

I've been reading PRO"S & CON"S about taking the cat out of the head pipes on the Newer HD"s. I thought someone had posted pics on this about a year ago and how to do it. Some say yeah go for it. It really works well getting rid of the heat on the right side. Other's say save your $$$$ over a grand if the dealer does it. And all you need is longer floorboards ?? I"D SERIOUSLY would like some HONEST answers on this. I have a friends head pipes which he took off his 14. If all I have to do is cut out the cat and re install them. OH HELL Yeah !! Now there should also be 2 cat's ? one in each head pipes ? HELP :xzqxz:............Thanks Rick

Look at post #15 in this thread-

http://www.hdforums.com/forum/touring-models/705286-picture-of-the-cat-in-the-head-pipe-2.html

It shows how to cut the cat out.

Regarding heat... Everyone's tolerance to heat is different. The heat coming off the stock exhaust (with the cat in it) does NOT bother me. However, it does bother my wife (passenger), so I run catless.

Many find that just moving the floorboards out gets them far enough away that they don't need to remove the cat to be comfortable.

Myself, I use the floorboard extensions, not for the heat, but because it is just more comfortable...more room to move my feet around.

Bottom line, if you right ankle, calf or thigh is getting uncomfortably warm, you will benefit installing floorboard extensions, if it is still too warm for your comfort, you will benefit further by removing the cat.

Another things folks do is get highway pegs....but this is not something you can use all the time, especially in stop & go traffic, so it can help get you away from the heat some of the time, but not all of it.

Kevin

 

[BOXX3R]

Does removing the cat void any factory or extended warranty? And does removing the cat violate any State laws?

 

[gerald martin]

removing cat

of course it can void your warranty if they want it to. Phone the Harley number that is in your owners manual

 

[Gorilla]

and yes it violates most state laws that have anything to do with emissions.

 

[msocko3]

and yes it violates most state laws that have anything to do with emissions.

:Agree:Not to mention it also violates the Federal clean air act and is punishable up to $2,500 for each incident of tampering. Folks don't give much thought to the fact a dealer could make a phone call and bring down a whole world of hurt on them. The government does take it very serious, they investigate any phone tips they receive.

IMO the best thing is do your own thing and keep the dealer out of it, but one has to be willing to possibly walk away from the warranty if the dealer catches them and has an issue with the modifications.

 

[Sloufoot]

:Agree:Not to mention it also violates the Federal clean air act and is punishable up to $2,500 for each incident of tampering. Folks don't give much thought to the fact a dealer could make a phone call and bring down a whole world of hurt on them. The government does take it very serious, they investigate any phone tips they receive.

IMO the best thing is do your own thing and keep the dealer out of it, but one has to be willing to possibly walk away from the warranty if the dealer catches them and has an issue with the modifications.

You are correct Mike ! But one has to marvel at the number of dealers that will sell & install all the headers you want without the CAT. Also if they installed the header, nothing is bothered with the warranty (if they are doing the warranty work). Out West, California is stricter on the dealers tho. Also some states are quite strict on inspections having to pass EPA specs.

Also Screwball, if the richer mix of gasses from the richer tune hits the CAT it has to do more work to re-burn the excess fuel not burned completely in the engine. There comes a higher than normal exhaust temps at the CAT area. The leaner gasses don't react the same when they hit the material in the cat.

 

[msocko3]

You are correct Mike ! But one has to marvel at the number of dealers that will sell & install all the headers you want without the CAT. Also if they installed the header, nothing is bothered with the warranty (if they are doing the warranty work). Out West, California is stricter on the dealers tho. Also some states are quite strict on inspections having to pass EPA specs. Also Screwball, if the richer mix of gasses from the richer tune hits the CAT it has to do more work to re-burn the excess fuel not burned completely in the engine. There comes a higher than normal exhaust temps at the CAT area. The leaner gasses don't react the same when they hit the material in the cat.

You're so right, these dealers are a hoot. They happily put illegal parts on and warranty it, then shake their finger at you and void the warranty if you do the same.

 

[rap47]

Not only will it eliminate heat on the right side, it will also eliminate excess heat on the transmission!

 

[msocko3]

Not only will it eliminate heat on the right side, it will also eliminate excess heat on the transmission!

Looking at the burned off cad plating on this exhaust bracket, I'd say the cat run a bit warm. This was on the 2010 Tiglide I used to have, it cooked the plating off when the engine was with just a stage 1 dealer download and the factory cat still in the head pipe. The plastic covering for the wiring harness through that area was pretty brittle also.

 

[1dn5up]

Yah , it gets pretty hot there. Mine is rusted. HD also recalled the rear brake light switch to be replaced and cook again. Another reason to86 the pussey !:Shrug:

 

[geezerglide11441]

:Agree:Not to mention it also violates the Federal clean air act and is punishable up to $2,500 for each incident of tampering. Folks don't give much thought to the fact a dealer could make a phone call and bring down a whole world of hurt on them. The government does take it very serious, they investigate any phone tips they receive.

IMO the best thing is do your own thing and keep the dealer out of it, but one has to be willing to possibly walk away from the warranty if the dealer catches them and has an issue with the modifications.

:Agree: 100% Really depends on your relationship with your dealer!!

Roger