Rear Brake System Questions: 2009 Kawasaki Voyager with Champion Conversion

[KWSchin]

Rear Brake System Questions: 2009 Kawasaki Voyager with Champion Conversion

I finally got the rear residual valve and have hooked up the rear brakes. I've bled both sides until no more bubbles come out. I even pulled the calipers and hung them higher than any other part of the circuit, with the bleeding nipple at the top. Brakes are still mushy, although they will stop the bike, unassisted, at slower speeds.

I understand that changing one caliper out for two, changes the volumetric ratio of the master cylinder to the calipers, so will that mean softer brakes, even if the rear circuit is bled?

Thanks for any thoughts!

Shin

[Rmitchell55]

Shin

When I did my trike, I bled through the top bleed port, then I removed the calipers and turned them upside down and then bled from the bottom (top) bleed port. Had a couple of bubbles still trapped in the lower piston. another thing that I did was loosened up the lock nut on the shaft of the M.C. and backed out the plunger one turn. I have been trying to find the bore diameter of the M/C and try to find something just a little bit larger. So far no luck. If I stomp really hard on the pedal I can lock up the rear brakes. Something that I haven't tried yet is mount the reservoir up a few inches so it's the highest point of the system.

[KWSchin]

Thanks Ray!

I'll keep fiddling with it. I know I have air, as it will pump up. Almost done with her. Have a few little things to tidy up, but I've probably got almost 75 miles on her, without bodywork, with bodywork, but no tour pack, and now with everything in place.

Gonna be fun!

Shin

Shin

When I did my trike, I bled through the top bleed port, then I removed the calipers and turned them upside down and then bled from the bottom (top) bleed port. Had a couple of bubbles still trapped in the lower piston. another thing that I did was loosened up the lock nut on the shaft of the M.C. and backed out the plunger one turn. I have been trying to find the bore diameter of the M/C and try to find something just a little bit larger. So far no luck. If I stomp really hard on the pedal I can lock up the rear brakes. Something that I haven't tried yet is mount the reservoir up a few inches so it's the highest point of the system.

[hank43]

Thanks Ray!

I'll keep fiddling with it. I know I have air, as it will pump up. Almost done with her. Have a few little things to tidy up, but I've probably got almost 75 miles on her, without bodywork, with bodywork, but no tour pack, and now with everything in place.

Gonna be fun!

Shin

Same bike, same Champion trike kit, same poor rear brakes. I have bled them 'till I'm blue in the face, I had the trike kit shop installed, mechanic can't do any better than I on the brakes. Learn how to use the front ones, I guess.

BTW, Have you tried Ivans engine ECU reflash? makes a world of difference, and, it actually makes the voyager shift better - mine is near silent now, don't know how I put up with all that klunking all these years!!

Also, yours is the same color as mine, I'm looking for some touch up paint, after 20k miles, lots of chips in the paint.

hank43

[KWSchin]

Same bike, same Champion trike kit, same poor rear brakes. I have bled them 'till I'm blue in the face, I had the trike kit shop installed, mechanic can't do any better than I on the brakes. Learn how to use the front ones, I guess.

BTW, Have you tried Ivans engine ECU reflash? makes a world of difference, and, it actually makes the voyager shift better - mine is near silent now, don't know how I put up with all that klunking all these years!!

Also, yours is the same color as mine, I'm looking for some touch up paint, after 20k miles, lots of chips in the paint.


hank43

Thanks for the info. Sounds like they're just that way. I've always used my front brake, with the rear. I don't like the mushy feeling.

Haven't heard of Ivan's Reflash. Gonna have to look into it. As for touch up paint, haven't looked into getting any, but I'm sure that my paint supply can match.

Thanks again! Shin

[Lee H. Mann]

I don't know if this will help, but it can't hurt to check.

Make sure calipers are in proper alignment with the rotor.
put 2 wheel nuts on each rotor and tighten down.
Loosen the 2 caliper mounting bolts and see if the caliper needs shims.
Loosen both caliper mounting bolts and see if pedal feels better when loose.

If it does, then they need alignment.

[Chappy KC]

This post may be too late to do any good but my VV with the Motor Trike kit has the same brake issue. Poor alignment to start with but the shop tech aligned the calipers with the rotors and it helped. I still need to pump them but at least I can get some stopping power. My next project will be to add the back flow residual valve and replace any rubber brake hoses with the metal ones. Other than that I would be at a loss.

[Chappy KC]

BTW, Have you tried Ivans engine ECU reflash? makes a world of difference, and, it actually makes the voyager shift better - mine is near silent now, don't know how I put up with all that klunking all these years!!

Hey Hank43;

You say the ECU flash by Ivan even helped the shifting? That alone would make it worth it! I'm definitely giving it a try if I don't sell this thing and get something more reliable.

[trike tech]

Gonna toss my .02 into the ring on this one (although it may not even be worth .02!).

If you're certain the brakes are fully bled and there is no air remaining in the system I would check to see if the brake line that goes from the master cylinder to the trike kit has been replaced or is the OE rubber line. If it's the rubber OE line, it may well be the cause of your issues with the soft rear brakes. With age they weaken and will swell more than you could imagine when applying brakes (add the extra volume of a second caliper and even a little swell can make a huge difference). If you have the rubber line I would recommend looking into replacing it with a braided stainless wrapped brake line; they are much stronger and typically don't swell with age.

Simply for "comparative" purposes - Back in my "speed freak" days, I had a "slightly" modified sport bike & was able to pull the brake lever all the way to the grip without any real effort. The bike stopped, but did leave a lot to be desired. I changed all the brake lines out to a quality braided and I was unable to pull the lever to the grip even using both hands to squeeze. It made a MASSIVE difference in braking & pressure required on the lever & foot pedal to apply brakes.

Like I said, just my .02 with a bit of personal feedback.