Lithium Ion Batteries

[roadking2]

Has anyone put a lithium ion battery in their trike? What make and model of trike is it being used in? What issues, if any, did it present? What about fitment? They generally are much smaller than conventional batteries so did you have any problems getting one to fit? When did you do it and how long has it been in use? Where did you get your battery? Do you still use any type of battery tender on it? What brand of tender, if you are using one, are you using and where did you get it? Are you using a lithium ion tender or a standard one? I guess that's plenty of questions for now. Many thanks if you can reply and answer a few of the questions I have about them. I'm in need of a new battery and I'm considering getting a lithium ion one. They supposedly last a lot longer, are much lighter, and hold their charge much better than conventional batteries but I don't know anyone that has one in their bike, trike, or car for that matter. I know they are pricey, but if the life is as good as advertised, they would be well worth it if they perform well in a bike or a trike.

 

[Phu Cat]

Roadking, I wouldn't swear to it, but it seems to me that Lithium batteries may take a special type of charger. You might want to check on that. Then again, I might be all wet.

PC

 

[Jack Klarich]

Roadking, I wouldn't swear to it, but it seems to me that Lithium batteries may take a special type of charger. You might want to check on that. Then again, I might be all wet.

PC

[h=3]Why you should not use a Battery Tender® on a lithium battery[/h] Here is the simple answer: A Battery Tender® can not measure State of Charge (SoC) of a lithium battery. It simply does not have this capability. While they work great on lead acid batteries, they are not able to accurately “read” lithium batteries. So, they will never properly charge a lightweight lithium battery.

Beyond SoC, the Battery Tender® is looking for a 6 cell battery, with each cell having roughly 2 volts. All lithium lightweight batteries are based on 4 cell packs, with each cell having roughly 3.3 volts. This sends the Battery Tender® a reading that is outside of the safe charging window, and contributes to the incompatibility.

So, how will this damage a lithium battery? The answer depends on a number of factors which are too numerous to go into here. The fact is that it wont work properly, it can damage a lightweight lithium battery, and will void your warranty…so dont do it.

A final note- when you see battery companies advertising “no battery tender required” or “works with battery tender”, they are either lying to you, or dont know any better. Neither of those options is good when working with a battery company and should raise a big red flag about their understanding of the products they are selling.

Look here for some info

 

[rhino 2]

Roadking, I wouldn't swear to it, but it seems to me that Lithium batteries may take a special type of charger. You might want to check on that. Then again, I might be all wet.

PC

Yes they do need a charger made for lithium battery's....

 

[hardwickbv]

After testing batteries for a major US entity for 25+ years including some of the first High Energy Lithium batteries and knowing what will happen when (notice I didn't say if) something goes wrong.

I would never put a lithium battery in my Trike..

Just my 2 cents

Bob

 

[roadking2]

After testing batteries for a major US entity for 25+ years including some of the first High Energy Lithium batteries and knowing what will happen when (notice I didn't say if) something goes wrong.

I would never put a lithium battery in my Trike..

Just my 2 cents

Bob

So what's going to go wrong?

 

[rhino 2]

So what's going to go wrong?

.......:blowup:..........

 

[frostbite51]

People say you need a special charger or tender for lithium batteries, but that raises the question: how does the charging system on your trike know?

When I worked for the solar outfit we checked out lithiums. We wanted something lighter than the 150# lead acid batteries we were using. We decided against them because of cost and because, at that time, 6 or 7 years ago, they said you can't charge a lithium if it's below freezing. I don't know if that's still true or not, but I found this:

https://electronics.stackexchange.c...atteries-in-cold-temperatures-would-harm-them

that explains a lot about the problem.

Now, you might say you'll never ride in freezing weather. I said that, too, then on our Yellowstone trip we got up one morning to 26 degree temps. And it took a spell to warm up that day.

It's your decision, but there's some reading material for you. Unless they've gotten a lot cheaper than the last time I looked I just can't justify the cost. But then, I tested lead acid batteries nearly every day for 8 years, so I know how to stretch them out...

 

[rhino 2]

Lithium lasts 10 years [so they say:Shrug:] How many keep their Trike for ten years...?

 

[hardwickbv]

Put simply I have witnessed a shorted D Cell lithium battery blow the 6" thick door off of a test chamber.

Temperature and vibration are bad things when it comes to batteries, most of the time everything works fine.

Its that one time it doesn't that things go really bad really fast.

Bob

 

[MikeyTX]

.......:blowup:..........

:LooksGreat: ................:Excited:

 

[MikeyTX]

So what's going to go wrong?

Do you have a CanBus system ? Yup ! Why would you risk using a battery that could cause issues. If you have basic warranty left or an extended warranty, I'd make damn sure it won't give the Mo Co a legal out.

 

[Jack Klarich]

The way these batteries are set up

If you over charge OR charge TOO fast you create TOO much heat

This will cause any battery to grenade

The Lithium Batteries are that much more dangerous

I have had group 4 acid batteries blow up It aint fun

Our battery room had sprinklers, fire retard system and a blow out wall

I am glad we only had one small explosion on my watch

If a Harley regulator sticks @ 15 volts or higher you could be sitting on a bomb JMO

 

[MikeyTX]

Gonna be interesting if the op does do the install.

 

[roadking2]

Gonna be interesting if the op does do the install.

Can't say I will and can't say I won't. They already have lithium batteries made specifically for motorcycles but I don't know anybody that has one. Deltran even makes some. Companies have been making them for several years now for cars so if they are all that dangerous, why are there easily available lithiums for cars, lawn tractors, ATV's, even jet skis, and the like? Summit Racing sells a ton of them for racing applications. If the alternators on a car can handle them, why can't a bike do the same? I also haven't heard any horror stories about them either. I'm very curious about them because they self discharge very little, are very small and light weight, pack a good punch, and last a very long time making their cost much more reasonable. I'd really like to hear some real life experiences before I make a decision and I'd like to know all I can before I make up my mind.

 

[roadking2]

Well, I haven't received much first hand info on here, but I've been investigating on my own. If you want the straight skinny on lithium ion batteries in a bike, read and listen to some of these.

He says you CAN use some battery tenders!

https://www.motorcyclistonline.com/news/lighten-lithium-ion-battery-gear#page-9. Notice many are used by race teams. Superbike and road racing.

https://www.sportrider.com/motorcycle-battery-basics-lead-acid-or-lithium#page-4 Notice that a lithium ion battery is OEM on a Ducati. Also note that Yuasa is developing one of their own for bike use and many of the batteries are DOT approved.

https://www.bikebandit.com/blog/post/lithium-motorcycle-battery-buyers-guide. Good read. Basic what it is, how it works, and who it is good for and who should probably stick with AGM

I also discovered that there are numerous youtube vids on lithium batteries for motorcycles and many brand specific ones too.

 

[rhino 2]

I don't know but for about a hunderd dollars two years ago i called my Friends at Amazon , And asked them to please send me a regular battery ,And they did in one day i might add And it has started my Tri Glide even when the temps are in the single digits..And also all the tenders and chargers that iv'e accumulated over the many years will work with that battery, Without any guessing is this particular charger gonna blow up my trike, or the battery.....

Lotta over thinking going on....

But it is interesting learning about something relatively new,,

Like my old Man,Would always say to me, ''Son''..[He always called me Son]... Knowledge is a Wonderfull thing and is never wasted, You never know if or when you'll need it again..

 

[Jack Klarich]

Like Bob said,

Knowledge is OWER

But only if you use it

I have NO doubt these batteries are here to stay

I always wondered why we cant make a smaller battery that lasts longer

WE surely have the know how

Now we have a market that demands it