2002 FLHTCUI Lehman conversion / Belt & Bearing question

[Boreshot]

Hello all. Thank you for this forum. It was a great find.

Recently my wife acquired her sisters Trike when she passed. She now has her permit and is riding along side of me (2005 Electra Glide CVO) Im fairly certain the trike was converted in 2003 or 2004. Its about to crack 100k miles. I believe a stage 3 or 4 kit was installed during the conversion, complete with power commander II.

Next week we come hell or high water we are getting out and riding to the Gatlinburg / Tail of Dragon area and we will take the trike over my CVO this time. I have found, what appears to have been for a long time, a hole in the center of the drive belt. Reading up as much as I can I have found that there is no covers on the back axle. I cannot remove plates to place the new belt on, I need to drop the left side of the axle, disconnect at the center, then wire it through the hole around the axle. This appears to be a design flaw IMO. Shouldn't have to break the axle apart to replace a belt. I have the install manual for my kit from the Lehman website, but the instructions have plate covers, and my bike does not.

Is there any belt replacement manuals instructing how to disconnect the axle?

Is there any instructions how to replace the main wheel bearing? Is it just pull the 4 nuts off within the drum break and the axle slides out?

How do I find out what type / part# to buy for the bearings if needed?

Im no certified mechanic, but I've done most of my own work unless it deals with electronics. Im comfortable taking the engine cover and clutch off to drop the swing arm off to replace the belt, I have the service manual for the bike, but no service manual for the Lehman kit. Just what appears to be a general install kit. I ask about the bearing because removing the tire the left side axle can move ever so slightly when I pull in/out real hard whereas right side is solid. Im also hearing a very faint squeaking now when we ride at slow speeds that doesn't stop when any break applied, but does on turns.

Thanks for any info you can help with. Ive got a bike trailer on standby and bought an emergency belt replacement kit Worse case comes to life we trailer the trike home, pack the Electra Glide CVO, and ride on.

Ill try to attach some pictures to get a better idea what I have. Thanks for this forum!

Aaron

[Lee H. Mann]

Aaron, Welcome to Trike Talk from West Virginia.

The manual that you downloaded from the Lehman site would be the latest version of that conversion.

Yours is an earlier conversion that has an earlier rear axle.

There is no manual for changing the belt, but I have the earlier assembly manual that can be helpful.

Changing the belt will require removing the swingarm. (major operation) www.mjtrikes.com

In order to change the belt on the V-Twin Harley-Davidson prior to 2007 requires the removal of the swingarm.

This appears to be a design flaw IMO.

You may want, considering the mileage, to install new swingarm bearings, axle bearings and possibly differential carrier bearings, and upgrades that have been added to your model since you will have all of these parts in front of you.

You might also consider using the narrower belt when doing the change. (less chance of getting a stone hole)

[Gorilla]

aaron welcome nice trike

[Boreshot]

Thanks for the responses. I think its a good idea. When I drop the swing arm and rear axle I might as well replace everything I can. Thank you for the link

[CrystalPistol]

Nice looking trike.

I would wonder if there's a way to enclose at least the lower run of the belt?

I know belts are long lived & generally maint free, but in a case like this, chain would seem a viable alternative. Two side by side would be killer.

[Boreshot]

Ok thought Id give an update to my winter rebuild

Its a 20yr old bike, and when you tear it down you don't want to put the old parts back on - like mufflers or shocks. So its becoming a several thousand dollar rebuild. It started as a quest to replace the drive belt, but found other issues that I found was not safe to ride.

#1 Come to find out the straw that broke the camels back was the swing arm pivot bolt sheared in two.

#2 The left axle adapter plate (Where pitch plates attach) had broken welds. Come to find they were only spot welded at the top & bottom. I had them re-welded all round.

Some of the replaced parts: New front drive pulley (sprocket), mufflers, shocks, smaller 1 1/8" BDL Goodyear drive belt, JIMS Primary Bearing Upgrade, 45 AMP FLT/FLH Stator & Rotor, Chain Tensioner, transmission Billet Steel Forks, Shifter Shaft Lever Spring (small), swing arm Isolators, upgraded Swing Arm Retrofit – w/ Axel (was Clevbloc), Front Motor Mount, front tire, Rivera Stiffey Kit, and inner and main wheel bearings to name a few. Of course new seals and gaskets all around.

Ended up buying tools Ill probably never use again so will sell on ebay (IE: Race Puller)

I've attached a few pictures. My advice - don't buy parts until you have completely broken down and disassembled what you are working on. Chances are you are opening a pandora's box - lol

[Boreshot]

Ok looking for some advice. I may be overthinking this and spending to much time.

I'm working on centering the axle and getting the belt adjustment centered and correct. I've gone from my old 1 1/2in belt to a new 1 1/8in belt. I've edited a picture of the axle to try and explain it as easy as I can understand.

Reading the current installation manual (My bike is earlier version):

"Check that belt is running about 0.030" from flange on rear pulley. Tap differential left or right to achieve this reading. Belt may ride next to flange as long as its not trying to climb."

"Center the differential to motorcycle frame - this is critical for proper belt tensioning. Make sure distance is within 1/16" from side to side."

(1/16th is about 1.6mm)

• If you look at figure A I created my axle measures 2mm to the right (Adjustment A) for centering. I tapped it right 2mm over to try and get belt off the flange.
  
• Again with reference to figure A, I've adjusted the axle along the pinch plates (Adjustment B) with the right side forward more than left by 3mm.
  

Even with having the axle shifted to the right 2mm and forward 3mm the belt is barley off the flange. If I move the belt away from the flange and spin the sprocket/belt by about the 10th full rotation it ends up just against the flange. Its not trying to ride up the flange from what I can see. I'm just worried what it will be @70mph.

To me it seems if the axle is not adjusted the same on the pinch plates the belt may travel left or right. Since my right side of the axle is forward by about 3mm one would think it would make the belt travel left away from the sprocket flange. I don't want to tap the axle right anymore (Adjustment A) to get belt away from flange because I want to keep it within the 1/16th variance.

Then my wife told me that even if I get the readings exact and bolts tighten to torque specs, chances are first narley turn and big pothole the centering will bump a little. Am I overthinking this?

The primary & cover is not installed yet. also I have a new front motor mount I planned to install. Any advice on centering or adjusting the belt movement? I'm thinking I shouldn't focus on centering the axle/belt until the primary is completely reassembled and I've swapped out the front motor mount.

Thanks for letting me vent and any info. Its a 20+yr old bike but its a family heirloom with immense value. I need to get this right but chances are with the bikes age and what its seen not much is straight and flush anymore

[Boreshot]

Update - additional questions / issues:

New bearings (inner and outer) installed. I mounted the differential to the sprocket based off the markings I made before taking apart.

After putting it back together (see pictures from above posts) I attached a drill to the transmission shaft (reverse threads) and spun the belt. I noticed a 'lobe' or 'wobble' in the back sprocket inside the housing. Very slight. Belt was waving up/down ever slightly but noticeable.

I took the axle apart again and checked the measurements as best I can with vernier calipers. I confirmed all bolts are tight on sprocket. Its an older version sprocket that the original was cut to work. I After taking the nuts off holding the diff I tried to see if there was any play to adjust, there was none I could see or feel.

I already installed a new front sprocket. Primary case installed with new all balls bearing instead of stock race / bearing. Clutch not installed yet. Makes it easier to put a drill on the trans shaft to spin the belt. Old belt was 1 1/2 and new belt is 1 1/8th. Bike has over 100k miles on it. With the belt dead center of front sprocket it rides the right flange on the back. Belt will travel right when spun. Axle left/right and forward/back within 1mm or less.

Should I look at replacing the back sprocket (70 tooth)? Since I replaced the front sprocket and the back has over 100k and created with original sprocket would it be best to go ahead and try out a new back one to see if fixes the wobble?

Any input appreciated please - thanks all.

[Jack Klarich]

With 100K on the OEM sprocket, as long as you have a new front sprocket and new belt I would swap out the rear sprocket also JMO

[tourman]

I'd never spend that much time & money on that old of a trike. Not worth it

[Boreshot]

More updates:

Yeap the man himself had a new rear sprocket for me, not the cut & created one, but new 1 1/8th in 70 tooth drive sprocket. Cant thank him enough!!! World of difference. No more wobble of sprocket and belt. Love it so far. New rear sprocket now matches the new belt & new front sprocket.

I'm not sure if anyone else has done this - but I've replaced the stock clev block style swingarm with a custom cycles bearing kit. Ill advise how it goes and how it feels. If you watch the YouTube video you will see the bearings pivots with leaning. I've also installed a Rivera Primo stiffy kit to fill the empty space in the isolators and firm it up.



I also bought a metzler888 rear tire for the front along with new 1in bearings. Using a rear tire for the front seems like it can take more weight and wider girth & more tread. Ill advise how it works out.

I found part numbers for my drum breaks and went to Napa to buy break wheel cylinders & pads. Asked the Napa dude what the breaks fit. He giggle and said well your cylinder can fit a 71 Gremlin and pads will fit 80's Ford LTD....I had a good laugh.

The bike has been an experience. I'm now getting nervous because I can see the end of rebuild road, and I'm wondering if I've done anything wrong. YouTube videos and service manual in hand lets hope not. We shall see.

[Jack Klarich]

More updates:

Yeap the man himself had a new rear sprocket for me, not the cut & created one, but new 1 1/8th in 70 tooth drive sprocket. Cant thank him enough!!! World of difference. No more wobble of sprocket and belt. Love it so far. New rear sprocket now matches the new belt & new front sprocket.

I'm not sure if anyone else has done this - but I've replaced the stock clev block style swingarm with a custom cycles bearing kit. Ill advise how it goes and how it feels. If you watch the YouTube video you will see the bearings pivots with leaning. I've also installed a Rivera Primo stiffy kit to fill the empty space in the isolators and firm it up.



I also bought a metzler888 rear tire for the front along with new 1in bearings. Using a rear tire for the front seems like it can take more weight and wider girth & more tread. Ill advise how it works out.

I found part numbers for my drum breaks and went to Napa to buy break wheel cylinders & pads. Asked the Napa dude what the breaks fit. He giggle and said well your cylinder can fit a 71 Gremlin and pads will fit 80's Ford LTD....I had a good laugh.

The bike has been an experience. I'm now getting nervous because I can see the end of rebuild road, and I'm wondering if I've done anything wrong. YouTube videos and service manual in hand lets hope not. We shall see.

Good job, best of luck on your shake down run

[Boreshot]

Update

Well trike has some miles on it now. Rode from Ohio to Savannah GA and on many other short trips. A vast difference to be sure. The old back sprocket was built off center so the ride lobed at highway speeds real bad. With the new milled sprocket the wife now darn near falls asleep riding!

Notes on upgrades I did:

• The stock clev block style swingarm was replaced with a custom cycles bearing kit. Corners are great and feels real solid.
  
• Rivera Primo stiffy kit to fill the empty space in the isolators and firm it up worked out well.
  
• I mounted a rear tire on the front. Feels firm around corners and so far working great.
  
• Don't short change yourself on shocks. Upgrades are worth it.
  

Now my bad news -

About 60miles outside Savannah I noticed pink oil under the primary. I use redline shockproof in the tranny. Yeap one of my seals is leaking. Behind the front sprocket against transmission. Very slow leak and only leaks when bike is moving. Rode all the way home (With purchased Redline in truck) without ever having to add oil. Its in a position and so slow the belt hasn't had a drop on it. My plan is to ride all year and pull the primary off for the winter project again.

Tools and parts came to about $4,500 in total for the 2000 Ultra Classic that was converted in 2004. Even with the slow leak Id ride the darn thing from Ohio to California if I had the chance without hesitation. Its a very solid trike now.

One thing I forgot and should have done with everything apart and exhaust off - check the cam chain tensioner. No sounds from there no observed issues with it, so that may be also for the winter Project.

Thanks All!!

[molokaimike]

With the miles that you have on your bike I would bet that your cam chain tensioners are worn out. The older model tensioners are spring loaded and put a lot of pressure on the tensioners. These should be inspected around the 20-30k mile mark. At the risk of spending your money, I would change the tensioners out to the newer hydraulic tensioners. Harley went with the hydraulic setup around 2005-2006, it uses oil pressure to provide tension on the cam chain instead of the stiff springs. The conversion kit also comes with a new cam plate and high volume oil pump and it's pretty much a set it and forget it setup.