Pro Action 14" Shocks and 14" Comfort Lift Combo Questions

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Hey man!

You are doing the same thing we do with all new parts. Exploring all the rabbit holes.

I think you have hit upon my problem, I've been tiling at wind mills and it's led me to rabbit holes :AGGHH:

When adjusting the pre-load, it is not as easy to get back to the starting point as it is with the clickers. I think you are really close to spot on, BUT, that does not mean it could not be a bit better.

I figured that, so I will be documenting every thing I do and being really careful about how much.

Three things if you start adjusting the pre-load:

1. It is easier to do with the tires removed. It can be done without, but is more difficult.

I'm getting good at jacking the trike up and removing the wheels

2. Since it is really easy to get lost from where you are now, make sure to keep track of how much you move the top collar, and in which direction, so you can get back to your starting point.

Yes, I will continue to document all the steps to "Wonderland" and what were the changes I felt after each adjustment ... I'm on page three already in my log

3. As little a 1/4 turn of the top collar (above the spring) will make a pretty significant difference. If you want a firmer ride, turn the collar clockwise, softer, twist it counter-clockwise.

So, clockwise as I look at it from the top of the shock, or the bottom (Guessing from the top, but, since I'll be laying on the ground, thought I'd ask). Also, small well documented changes ... got it

You are already different, in that the vast majority (including myself) find that 3 & 3 on the clickers provides the preferred ride, but from what you've written, you like firmer, and combined with your bumper not being all the way down after hitting some good bumps, my guess would be that if you had a tad less pre-load (maybe 1/4 to 1/2 turn counter-clockwise) that would make the springs Softer, and you could run your clickers firmer (4 or 5) and it may be your ideal.

Say it isn't so, me being different ... did I mention my coveralls ... Oval shield that says, "A.B.Normal Engineering"?

Seriously, about the preload, I still think I have bottomed out a few times in just my normal riding area. I decided this morning to really see where the bumpers where ... I'm having a hard time getting in there to really "see" them ... so, I jacked it up, pulled the wheels and both of the bumpers were on the bottom. I mean like no gap at all. So, I pushed them back up, put the wheels back on, torqued them and headed out for a ride. I kind of followed my "tuning" ride track. It has some around town, some country roads and some highway. There is some frost heaves, train tracks, expansion joints and other fun stuff. Total ride about 40 miles.

BUT, it is all a matter of experimenting, at which you are good. Looking forward to seeing where you end up at the end of your rabbit holes.

I hear you saying experimenting ... But, I think you're being nice and really saying "Tilt Away" Don Quixote ... LOL ... but, I am good at that ...

Kevin

When I got home anxious to pull the wheels again (not really, but, the beast isn't gonna let this go anytime soon), there were ambulances in my cul-de-sac, and my first thought was Mom. Fortunately it wasn't mom, but, my neighbor. She'd had another stroke, I think this makes four in the last six months. Apparently this was a bad one and she was in a coma. I stayed near the head of the street with another neighbor mainly to keep out of the way.

They finally got her "stabilized" and off to the hospital. By this time most of her large family was parked in the cul-de-sac, so I parked at the head of the street. And walked down to my house. My neighbor's son (my age) approached me and told me what was going on. He asked if I could take his dad's dog for the rest of the day while the family went to the hospital. Her name is Midge and Harley thinks she is "all that and a bag of chips". I said sure and brought her over to play with Harley. A little while ago, the cul-de-sac started to clear out, so I walked down to put the trike in the garage. The son approached me again and asked if I could keep Midge until around 7 or 7:30pm. I said as long as you need me to keep her. She is a Yorkie, but, she still has a long tail and is a little porker, reminds me of the foot stool dog in "Beauty and the Beast", almost square ... LOL. Guess both Harley and I are into Fat Bottom Girls ... LOL. So I'm not gonna get to the trike the rest of the day.

I'm thinking about adding a 1/4 turn to the springs and putting the clicker thing back to 3 and 3 if the bumpers are back at the bottom. I think I bottomed out three times this morning, but, it may just be the shocks doing their job or I bottomed out in a hard "jolt". The bumpers should tell the story in the morning. If I do adjust the pre load, I will go back to 3 and 3 as a starting point on the clicker. And will not adjust that until the preload allows the bumpers to get close to the bottom, but, not all the way. I'll do this in 1/4 turn increments. Then start playing with the clicker again.

My thought process is by adding a little more pre load and removing some rebound, it will get me the stability I like and the control to give it a good ride. I have also sensed by running the clickers to 4 or 5, the shocks slow down and don't respond as well in the bumps, making the ride less optimal. Guess I'll know after all the tilting.

Please, just don't call me Alice. Don Quixote is okay, just not Alice.

 

[ultrafxr]

You crack me up! I absolutely despise jacking the back end up and removing the wheels. It is a major league PIA so I can't imagine what you are going through. Hope you get it all dialed in to your liking soon. I'm getting tired just reading this, lol.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

You crack me up! I absolutely despise jacking the back end up and removing the wheels. It is a major league PIA so I can't imagine what you are going through. Hope you get it all dialed in to your liking soon. I'm getting tired just reading this, lol.

I might build the 4" x 4" jacking cradle, so, it's not as bad as it could be .. :AGGHH:

 

[PosseRider]

You crack me up! I absolutely despise jacking the back end up and removing the wheels. It is a major league PIA so I can't imagine what you are going through. Hope you get it all dialed in to your liking soon. I'm getting tired just reading this, lol.

+1

 

[DK Custom Products]

When I got home anxious to pull the wheels again (not really, but, the beast isn't gonna let this go anytime soon), there were ambulances in my cul-de-sac, and my first thought was Mom. Fortunately it wasn't mom, but, my neighbor. She'd had another stroke, I think this makes four in the last six months. Apparently this was a bad one and she was in a coma. I stayed near the head of the street with another neighbor mainly to keep out of the way.

They finally got her "stabilized" and off to the hospital. By this time most of her large family was parked in the cul-de-sac, so I parked at the head of the street. And walked down to my house. My neighbor's son (my age) approached me and told me what was going on. He asked if I could take his dad's dog for the rest of the day while the family went to the hospital. Her name is Midge and Harley thinks she is "all that and a bag of chips". I said sure and brought her over to play with Harley. A little while ago, the cul-de-sac started to clear out, so I walked down to put the trike in the garage. The son approached me again and asked if I could keep Midge until around 7 or 7:30pm. I said as long as you need me to keep her. She is a Yorkie, but, she still has a long tail and is a little porker, reminds me of the foot stool dog in "Beauty and the Beast", almost square ... LOL. Guess both Harley and I are into Fat Bottom Girls ... LOL. So I'm not gonna get to the trike the rest of the day.

I'm thinking about adding a 1/4 turn to the springs and putting the clicker thing back to 3 and 3 if the bumpers are back at the bottom. I think I bottomed out three times this morning, but, it may just be the shocks doing their job or I bottomed out in a hard "jolt". The bumpers should tell the story in the morning. If I do adjust the pre load, I will go back to 3 and 3 as a starting point on the clicker. And will not adjust that until the preload allows the bumpers to get close to the bottom, but, not all the way. I'll do this in 1/4 turn increments. Then start playing with the clicker again.

My thought process is by adding a little more pre load and removing some rebound, it will get me the stability I like and the control to give it a good ride. I have also sensed by running the clickers to 4 or 5, the shocks slow down and don't respond as well in the bumps, making the ride less optimal. Guess I'll know after all the tilting.

Please, just don't call me Alice. Don Quixote is okay, just not Alice.

Sorry to read about your neighbor.

I thought I had read that you checked the bumpers and they were a little ways from the bottom still....but if you are bottoming out, where you feel it bottom, then you want some more pre-load on the springs. That would be done by turning the collar, at the top of the shock, clock-wise (while looking down at the shock from the top).

When we were developing these 14" Trike Series Shocks™, you would not believe the number of variations we put Pro Action thru. Several times I thought they were going to tell us to take a long walk off a short pier. lol

But we kept testing and kept asking for more changes. They were very patient, and in the end we have a shock that has set the standard.

Sounds like you have a good plan...and I know, until you execute it, examining all the possibilities, it will always be in the back of your mind that you might be able to dial it in a little better. Nothing wrong with that at all, in my book.



Kevin

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Sorry to read about your neighbor.

I thought I had read that you checked the bumpers and they were a little ways from the bottom still....but if you are bottoming out, where you feel it bottom, then you want some more pre-load on the springs. That would be done by turning the collar, at the top of the shock, clock-wise (while looking down at the shock from the top).

Kevin

I did write that early on. When I first did the test ride after putting the bumpers all the way up, I rode around and avoided the big bumps. When I did that, I ended up with about an 1" to 1.25" of shaft under the bumpers. But basically I never "pushed" the shock to do their job. So, this morning I will be taking the wheels off once again. Midge was picked up around 7 last night so I'm done with doggie day care at least for now. It wasn't much duty as she's a cute little thing.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Sorry to read about your neighbor.

I thought I had read that you checked the bumpers and they were a little ways from the bottom still....but if you are bottoming out, where you feel it bottom, then you want some more pre-load on the springs. That would be done by turning the collar, at the top of the shock, clock-wise (while looking down at the shock from the top).

I did write that early on. When I first did the test ride after putting the bumpers all the way up, I rode around and avoided the big bumps. When I did that, I ended up with about an 1" to 1.25" of shaft under the bumpers. But basically I never "pushed" the shock to do their job. So, this morning I will be taking the wheels off once again. Midge was picked up around 7 last night so I'm done with doggie day care at least for now. It wasn't much duty as she's a cute little thing.

When we were developing these 14" Trike Series Shocks™, you would not believe the number of variations we put Pro Action thru. Several times I thought they were going to tell us to take a long walk off a short pier. lol

But we kept testing and kept asking for more changes. They were very patient, and in the end we have a shock that has set the standard.

This is exactly why I don't hesitate to use your products, I've watched some of the R&D you guys go through before you market a product. It's basically ready for prime time when you do.

Sounds like you have a good plan...and I know, until you execute it, examining all the possibilities, it will always be in the back of your mind that you might be able to dial it in a little better. Nothing wrong with that at all, in my book.

Yea ... the "beast" doesn't ever let it go until I get to a conclusion, logical or not ... :AGGHH:



Kevin

I'll make a decision as to how much if any, I add based on where the bumpers are when I pull the wheels. It will be between 0 and 10 turns of preload added .... Just kidding ... it will be between 1/4 to 1/2 turns.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Strikes, Outs, Balls and Singles

Up until this morning, I've been pitching balls and strikes. Sometimes getting an out, sometimes getting a single ... thought maybe you'd guys appreciate a little baseball analogy since ya can't have the real thing ...

So first sign of light this morning, I jacked the trike up, removed the wheels and both bumpers were as far down as they could get. Moved both clickers to 3 clicks, loosened the set screw on one shock at a time and turned the ring on top clockwise (looking from the top of the shock) 1/4 turn, tightened the set screw, moved the bumper to the top, repeat on the other side. Put the wheels back on, snugged the lugs, lowered the trike and torqued the lugs. 1/4 turn pre load added. Wheew.

Picked up the few tools I used and put them on the little table I use as a driveway workbench. My $25 Harbor Freight torque wrench rolled off the table right onto the driveway, breaking off the lock down screw.



So, my first ride was to test the preload and go scare up a new torque wrench. No luck so early in the morning, so just went home and jacked it up again, removed the wheels ... bumpers at the bottom still. Added a 1/4 turn more pre load. put it back together. Tried the torque wrench, and it did the click thing about where it felt like it should. Took a chance, rode to harbor freight and of course all they had was a 50#-300# 3/4" drive torque wrench. Not something I needed. Rode over to Lowes, which had just opened, and got a 50#-150# 1/2" drive torque wrench, close enough, even on sale. Opened it in the parking lot and checked the torque, 95#. So on with the testing. Now at 1/2 turn.

When I got home, jacked it up and removed the wheels ... both bumpers on the bottom, still. What the heck, another 1/4 turn. Button it up and head out to retest. Now at 3/4 turn.

Came home, jacked up ... yada yada yada ... bumpers still at the bottom .... hmmm ... beginning to wonder if the bumpers are just sliding down by themselves. Added a 1/4 turn, buttoned it up, and back on the road. Now at 1 turn.

Came back home ... yada yada yada ... bumpers were 1/8" from the bottom .... "Happy Days are Here Again" ... to be honest, not sure my left shoulder (the one I had the rotator cuff repaired) could stand another yada yada yada. :blush:

So with it all buttoned up, I adjusted the clickers to 4 and 4 ... trusty long screw driver in the tour pak, off to see how the ride was ... I was concentrating earlier on was the trike really bottoming out or not, so really did not notice the ride on the little bumps ... it's been better since adding the shocks. Off to see the ride quality on my little track.

Not too shabby, no bottoming, that was a big change. The shocks were absorbing the bumps, but they seemed "sluggish". Best way I can describe it.

Pulled over ironically, in the Lowes parking lot and moved the clickers down to 3 and 3 clicks. Off to test again. You can "feel" the shocks working independently and absorbing the bumps. Really good ride, best yet. But how does it perform on I 70 and the notorious 1500 foot drop with the left turn in the middle at 75 mph. Only one way to find out. So off I headed to a new windmill (or rabbit hole if you will).

The trike is one hand-able in all the turns, even at 75 mph. With the pre load set right, the shocks just eliminate most of that feeling I hate. Probably all, but, my brain insists there is some still, but, even with that it's very doable. The ride at 75 mph is very comfortable. Alan is very happy riding the Fat Bottom Girl (get your minds out of the gutter).

So how come the shocks were so far off from DK? I think I seriously underestimated the weight that resides in the trunk. My two tool bags are probably over 125# together. Add to that the riding gear bag, helmets, and Lord knows what else I've got back there ... Probably close to the weight of a co rider (not the 8# I quoted ... for Harley ... :blush:. I believe I guessed 65# including the 8# of Harley. Probably closer to 150-160#. So, my bad.

So lessons learned:

1) Don't guess when answering the questions to set up the shocks. Kind of important.

2) Before you even consider playing with the clicker, test the preload with the bumpers, cause you probably lied to DK about what you carry :blush:. Or how much you weigh ... I might have put on a few pounds since the Chinese Virus thing, pity eating (like I need an excuse to eat) and haven't seen the gym in as much time either. Who knows, haven't been near a scale in months. I feel like my shirts are looser, but, that could be wishful thinking.

3) A 1/4 turn is a bugger when the set screw gets towards the back of the trike. Doable, but, challenging.

4) Always document, document, document ... especially if playing with the preload. So easy to get confused.

5) You can actually get the yada yada yada down to about 25-30 minutes if you leave the tools where ya need them when your testing. :Shrug:

So, am I done? ... yep, I am,

Maybe,

I think,

Probably,

although, the beast might need me to test at 2 clicks on both shocks :AGGHH:.

Home Run ... Drop the Mic (maybe I should stick to baseball, not sure what that means)

P.S. Since I'm now riding at 3 clicks on both shocks .... maybe I'm not so A.B. Normal as I thought ... naw ... who am I kidding :Shrug:

 

[DK Custom Products]

Glad you got it figured out.

Yeah, you had 60 lbs for riding Luggage/Gear weight.

For the difference we would have done 1 full extra turn of pre-load, and that is where you ended up. So that worked out perfectly.

In the meantime, you learned a ton about how the shocks work and how small differences can really have a significant effect on the ride quality.

I know you're gonna get many miles of smiles out of your FBG II.

Kevin

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Glad you got it figured out.

Yeah, you had 60 lbs for riding Luggage/Gear weight.

For the difference we would have done 1 full extra turn of pre-load, and that is where you ended up. So that worked out perfectly.

In the meantime, you learned a ton about how the shocks work and how small differences can really have a significant effect on the ride quality.

Not to mention, it kept the Beast at bay for a little while ... :AGGHH:

I know you're gonna get many miles of smiles out of your FBG II.

Kevin

I’m smelling a new Rabbit Hole. Might try 2 clicks on both ... ya know ... just to be thorough ... ��

 

[ultrafxr]

Alan you probably need to get some new wheel studs and lug nuts. I think yours are worn out by now, lol. Seriously glad you got it dialed in.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Alan you probably need to get some new wheel studs and lug nuts. I think yours are worn out by now, lol. Seriously glad you got it dialed in.

I've only ever had the wheels off like 8 times ... so I should be good.

 

[Trampas]

I'm glad to see you have it finally dialed in, at least I hope so, I do enjoy reading your posts though. I guess a person really needs to think how much weight you have when filling out the form as you found out and maybe say a extra 25 lbs to be sure, I know me I have only around 10 lbs or less in tour pack and nothing in the trunk and have no passenger now since she moved away, I'm sure later on down the road that might change, who knows. I do have a trailer I used to haul behind my road king going to sturgis but haven't used it or went to sturgis since 2003.

All for now Trampas

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

I'm glad to see you have it finally dialed in, at least I hope so, I do enjoy reading your posts though. I guess a person really needs to think how much weight you have when filling out the form as you found out and maybe say a extra 25 lbs to be sure, I know me I have only around 10 lbs or less in tour pack and nothing in the trunk and have no passenger now since she moved away, I'm sure later on down the road that might change, who knows. I do have a trailer I used to haul behind my road king going to sturgis but haven't used it or went to sturgis since 2003.

All for now Trampas

Yea ... when I decided to pull the trigger on the shocks, the questions/interview kind of caught me off guard, did a lot of guessing ... LOL ... much to my detriment. Good news, the preload is set (I really don't want to go through that again ... LOL ... shoulder is really telling me to "let it go", but, the beast is saying, "man up and do the tilting") and the ride is awesome. Might be a little firm, but, I think I like it like that ... might try the 2 clicks on both sides, but, that's an easy to do change. With the preload set now, might try 3 on the right and 2 on the left. The way I understand it, that would be like 2.5 on each ... if a little less rebound makes it a little more plush and I keep the Highway stability, I think I would like the more comfortable ride around town, we'll see.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

I did try 2 clicks on each shock, too mushy for my taste. Now at 3 clicks right, 2 clicks left and I really like the ride and the highway stability was good, although with 25-30 mph winds it was kind of hard to compare apples to apples. Gonna keep it here for a few hundred miles.

Got over 100 with these settings, and re torqued the wheels at 50 and 100 miles. So now it's time to ride.

 

[DK Custom Products]

I’m smelling a new Rabbit Hole. Might try 2 clicks on both ... ya know ... just to be thorough ... ��

I remember when we got the final prototype installed, and realized it was all we had hoped for. I still took about 2 hours to make a 45 minute trip. I kept stopping and adjusting the clickers to all different combinations to see how they each rode.



I've now had them on 3 & 3 for over 50K miles. That is the best spot for me...but not necessarily everyone.

I did try 2 clicks on each shock, too mushy for my taste. Now at 3 clicks right, 2 clicks left and I really like the ride and the highway stability was good, although with 25-30 mph winds it was kind of hard to compare apples to apples. Gonna keep it here for a few hundred miles.

Got over 100 with these settings, and re torqued the wheels at 50 and 100 miles. So now it's time to ride.

That's the nice thing about the clickers (bleed control), they can be adjusted to fine tune. 3 & 2 will give a ride like having them both at 2.5.

Kevin

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Haven't ridden in a day or so .. they are all blurring together, with the Haley issues ... Maybe this weekend when he's with the Vet.

 

[Fearless]

So you know...

Jacked up old Shiney and took a turn on the preload today. Ride tomorrow see how it goes bumpers we're on the bottom.:Shrug: Ride safe Fred

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Finally couldn't take the wandering around the house aimlessly anymore. Decided what I really needed was some wind in my face and bugs in my teeth. This is a good time of the year for the whole bugs in the teeth thing.

Put the audio Bible on and headed to Utah. When I got to Green River, about 115 miles from home, I filled up and headed back home. Took a little detour so ended up with almost 150 miles on the return tank.

Purpose of the ride was to check out the suspension. I am absolutely loving the new shocks and lift. I think I have found the perfect balance. Really good ride quality over the bumps. Significantly improved stability on the highway. Today the was about 20 mph of wind. Trike handled really well.

I got 38.6 mpg with the tail wind, 33.2 mpg with the head wind. Might have been a little lees wind in my face than when it was at my back. Like almost 36 mpg average at 75 mph.

I think my windmill tilting is over ... at least with the shocks ... :AGGHH:

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

3AM

Apparently the Beast is not done with the windmill tilting around the shocks, and I'm glad.

I woke abruptly at 3 am this morning with two words on my mind .... Tire Pressure

So a little background:

1) Like most folks entering the Tri Glide world, I thought the trike had a terrible ride and steered like a 1950's truck without power steering.

2) When I first did searches about the ride, I realized that lowering tire pressure would help, been running 21# ever since. The consensus was 20-22#, so I split the difference. Although I didn't know it, this resulted in the uneasy feeling in a 75 mph turn while going downhill. Felt like the trike just wanted to squat to the outside of a turn. Never really felt unsafe, or really slowed down much, but, the trike always had my full attention in those situations, still does.

3) The other issue was the steering. Again, a cheap fix was a lift kit, not perfect in fixing the heavy steering, but, good bang for the buck since it also removed the "load" in the Tri's "Pants" and help with the pipe dragging.

4) Recently I ordered Goodyear Comfort Treads for the rear, and the Cobra Trike tire for the front. With the softer sidewall, I wondered if I'd need to raise the tire pressure, and wanted to pose that question to the forum if a search didn't result in the answer.

So, with that on my mind, the Beast put 2 and 2 together and came up with 6 ... LOL ... or another windmill tilt or rabbit hole about trying raised tire pressure in the rear before the new "feets" were installed ... which woke me at 3 am. Went back to sleep, never removing the CPAP mask.

So 7am, I was out doing a parking brake adjustment )already planned), then off to Big O to have them adjust the tire pressure to 26#, as prescribed by the owners manual. Since I'm a fan of nitrogen, I figured go to the max, I can remove it in 1-2# increments if need be. I tipped the tech and headed for the highway to test my theory.

Highway stability was awesome. My least favorite turn in my neck of the woods was very comfortable at 75 mph ... who knew 6# could make that difference. But, did I destroy the good ride I had worked so hard to achieve?

Back to my designated test track to see how the ride was. Initial conditions, 36# front, 26# rears, 1 additional turn of preload (which turns out to be what it would of been had I not guessed about what I really carried), 3 clicks right shock, 2 clicks left shock. The weirdest thing happened, I expected the ride to be rough, but, it was very plush, almost too much. So, pulled over, got out my long screw driver and added a click to the left side. Redid the test track, and the ride was awesome. Went back to the highway, the stability thing stayed very good.

Nirvana achieved ... well ... at least until the new tires arrive and get installed. Then I may have to adjust the tire pressures some. :AGGHH: