Lehmann trike rear drum brake problem

[RonG]

I have a 2001 Suzuki intruder 1400 with a Lehmann vagabond trike conversion. I am looking for a service manual first! Currently I have it on jacks because I was checking the brake shoes for their thickness. I believe this is a 79/80 mustang brake but I am ready to be corrected. When I took off the right drum, I found a cable that was disconnected and dangling. It's the parking brake cable and it has a slightly rounded piece of metal with a hook at the end. My problem is that I don't know where it hooks too!! Any help would be appreciated and a photo would make me extremely grateful.

Adjustment procedure would be appreciated also, since the left drum appears to be stuck and I'm not sure if I over adjusted it thinking I was loosening the adjuster or popped something off internally. Before I put a puller on the drum I'd like to find out if I have another problem?

 

[Jack Klarich]

Hi Ron. If you have a ford type brake shoe set up the cable will be for the self adjuster lever Look here is a left side view of a typical ford rear drum brake set up. If you got the brakes adjusted up too tight you can reach in thru the backing plate hole at the bottom. You will have to poke a long skinny screw driver in to push the self adjuster lever away from the star wheel adjuster. Now you can turn the adjuster in some with a brake spoon. This will get the drum back off again. I sand the ridge in the drums before I put them back on so I get a better adjustment

 

[Jack Klarich]

This is what an undamaged cable looks like

 

[Lee H. Mann]

When I took off the right drum, I found a cable that was disconnected and dangling. It's the parking brake cable and it has a slightly rounded piece of metal with a hook at the end. My problem is that I don't know where it hooks too!! Any help would be appreciated and a photo would make me extremely grateful.

Adjustment procedure would be appreciated also, since the left drum appears to be stuck and I'm not sure if I over adjusted it thinking I was loosening the adjuster or popped something off internally. Before I put a puller on the drum I'd like to find out if I have another problem?

The drawing that Jack provided is correct. The self-adjusting cable attaches to the little foot. Self-adjusters don't really work B/C the trike is too light to actuate them properly. Don't use a puller to remove the drum unless you are prepared to replace all of the internal parts. Study the drawing and you can see the star-wheel will need to be rotated to retract the shoe. The old shoe type brakes are too uncomplicated for people of today to understand.:Shrug:

Once the repairs are done, back-off the E-brake adjuster and adjust each wheel for slight drag. Once equal drag has been achieved, apply foot brake several times and see if the drag has been affected. If the drag is consistent on each wheel, adjust E-brake so that it grabs about half way up the pull.

If the wheels drags too much, it will cause the shoes to overheat, crack or even lock up in severe cases.

A slight adjustment is required every 5-10,000 miles.ThumbUp

 

[RonG]

Thank you Jack Klarich and Lee H Mann

Thank you Jack for the diagram and advice. It is the self adjuster cable and I'll bet the last person in there didn't realize it and left it dangling or hooked to the wrong place. I read what Lee said and I agree! I think I'll just remove the cables from the assembly (cables is in hopes of getting the left drum off). I'll be playing with it today, and If I can get a screw driver in there I'll try and pop the adjuster off.

I agree with Lee, it's a simple system. I'm a retired aircraft mechanic, so I have to think back to the days of round engines and propellers to get my head in the game. I haven't worked on brakes like since I was a kid and that was a Loooong time ago. Everything I've done is either pads or pucks for years.

If either of you know where to get a service manual for this particular conversion, let me know. I have a Suzuki intruder 1400 manual and recently picked up a spare parts bike cheap. but the vagabond needs some attention also. Thanks again to both of you and I would look forward to any advice you can give me.

 

[Lee H. Mann]

Thank you Jack for the diagram and advice. It is the self adjuster cable and I'll bet the last person in there didn't realize it and left it dangling or hooked to the wrong place. I read what Lee said and I agree! I think I'll just remove the cables from the assembly (cables is in hopes of getting the left drum off). I'll be playing with it today, and If I can get a screw driver in there I'll try and pop the adjuster off.

I agree with Lee, it's a simple system. I'm a retired aircraft mechanic, so I have to think back to the days of round engines and propellers to get my head in the game. I haven't worked on brakes like since I was a kid and that was a Loooong time ago. Everything I've done is either pads or pucks for years.

If either of you know where to get a service manual for this particular conversion, let me know. I have a Suzuki intruder 1400 manual and recently picked up a spare parts bike cheap. but the vagabond needs some attention also. Thanks again to both of you and I would look forward to any advice you can give me.

There is not much in the way of a service manual for any Lehman Trikes. Installers were factory trained and Lehman wanted the customers to support the dealers ..... that didn't happen. Customers ended up working on their own trikes, dealers shut down ...... end of story. I still have parts though .... the ones that I was saving for the customers that never showed up.:cxtv:

 

[RonG]

Working on the brake

Thank for the reply Lee H Mann. I thought there might be some technical data or drawings around. I also can't find much mention of the Vagabond conversion but one can always hope. Before I gave up my solo bike and bought this, the previous owner apparently had a collision that someone ran into the rear bumper. the bumper was repaired but not well. It appears to be held on with two bolts and there is wiring that runs into it for the tail lights. I believe the entire bumper comes off separately. If anyone knows about a Vagabond, please let me know, because I'll remove it and repair it.

Still fighting with the left brake. I can't get the drum off. but I'll keep trying and let you know if I'm a success or a failure. any thoughts and ideas will be gratefully accepted.

 

[Lee H. Mann]

The rear bumper you refer to is called a lightbar. Has Kuryakyn Diamond lights (6) and is usually wired from one taillight.

It is usually fastened with 4 bolts. You may have to remove several of the light assemblies to find the bolts. There is usually a gasket (door edge guard) between the lightbar and body too. Be careful with the lights, they are no longer available either.

 

[Jack Klarich]

Thank for the reply Lee H Mann. I thought there might be some technical data or drawings around. I also can't find much mention of the Vagabond conversion but one can always hope. Before I gave up my solo bike and bought this, the previous owner apparently had a collision that someone ran into the rear bumper. the bumper was repaired but not well. It appears to be held on with two bolts and there is wiring that runs into it for the tail lights. I believe the entire bumper comes off separately. If anyone knows about a Vagabond, please let me know, because I'll remove it and repair it.

Still fighting with the left brake. I can't get the drum off. but I'll keep trying and let you know if I'm a success or a failure. any thoughts and ideas will be gratefully accepted.

I assume there is a hole in the backing plate to adjust the star wheel? If you cannot reach in to hold the self adjuster lever away from the star wheel adjuster you can try to pry the star wheel out from between the bottom of the brake shoes. This is hard to do but can be done. Once the adjuster is either backed off or knocked out of the web of the shoes, they will retract enuff to get the drum off. Here you see the lever attached @ the bottom of the shoes via the self adjuster cable and a return spring. ( the lever is red in the pictures)

 

[RonG]

Lee h mann, I read somewhere that those diamond lights where no longer available so I will be very careful with them. Thank you for the info on the rear bumper. That's going to be a project down the road, but the information is now filed for future use. It's a shame that no one has put together a service and repair manual for the Lehmann trikes in general. Just a generalized manual would probably work for the thousands of owners.

Jack, I have the rear end jacked up but as you know it is difficult to see thru the adjusting slot. It appears like the adjuster is all the way retracted, but the drum is still stuck so that it will not rotate. I'm going to try and get a screw driver in there and try to drive the adjustor off the brake shoes. I'll let you know if I get it!!

 

[Jack Klarich]

Lee h mann, I read somewhere that those diamond lights where no longer available so I will be very careful with them. Thank you for the info on the rear bumper. That's going to be a project down the road, but the information is now filed for future use. It's a shame that no one has put together a service and repair manual for the Lehmann trikes in general. Just a generalized manual would probably work for the thousands of owners.

Jack, I have the rear end jacked up but as you know it is difficult to see thru the adjusting slot. It appears like the adjuster is all the way retracted, but the drum is still stuck so that it will not rotate. I'm going to try and ge a screw driver in there anmd try to drive the adjustor off the pads. I'll let you know if I get it!!

Do you have a parking brake? Is it adjusted and or cables sticking holding the brake on?

 

[RonG]

Jack, doesn't seem to be the parking brake but I'll examine it further. I'll let you what I find.

Rong

 

[Lee H. Mann]

Jack, doesn't seem to be the parking brake but I'll examine it further. I'll let you what I find.

Rong

Is the drum loose on the axle hub ?

Can you wobble the drum ?:Shrug:

 

[RonG]

HOORAY

I've been fiddeling with this brake drum for days. Finally got it off by opening the bleeder on the wheel cylinder, totally releasing the parking brake entirely and cutting the "Pivot pins" when I could see to cut them. Then prying with large screw drivers a little at a time and finally the drum came off! As I was collecting parts and pieces I notice that there was only one wheel cylinder pin? I think maybe the missing pin allowed one brake shoe to work OK making the trike brake evenly and when I went to pull the drum off it cocked the shoe and caused my difficulty. I just don't know.

My thanks and appreciation to everyone, Lee and Jack especially helpful, I'll let you know when I have things back together, I've decided new shoes new springs and rebuild wheel cylinders all around and the drums are getting a shave also.

RonG

 

[Jack Klarich]

Good job, I am watching Dont forget to put a bit of lube on the high spots on the backing plate. This helps the shoes to expand and contract easier plus it helps to dampen noise