In case you have not seen Harley-Davidson's New Business Plan-

Unfortunately motorcycle sales continue to decline throughout the industry, not just for Harley. The Big Four Japanese manufactures used to all have an extensive line of "cruiser style" V-Twin bikes. Now the have hardly any. Polaris discontinued the Victory line altogether.

It seems to be easy to bash the MoCo for what they are doing. But the reality is that they have to try to become more efficient in order to remain competitive. Such as closing the Kansas City plant and consolidating production at York.

They simply did not need the production capacity any longer. Sad situation, but that's the reality. At least H-D is trying to recruit new riders/younger people. I don't know how successful they've been so far.

As for where their revenue comes from, here are the numbers for 2019 taken from their fourth quarter report on their website:

Total vehicles shipped: 213939

Revenue from motorcycle sales: $3,538,963,000.00

General merchandise sales: $237,566,000.00

Parts & Accessories: $713,400,000.00

Total: $4,489,929,000.00

While the total revenue for 2019 is almost $4.5 billion, it is actually down about 8% from 2018 and when it was almost $5 billion.

Also, the total number of vehicles shipped is down 6.4% compared to 2018. UK

DK Custom Products said:

Here it is. Get Ready!

No Sportster or Softail models mentioned at all.

Electric is second on their list.

Kevin

Click to expand...

Kevin,

It is also interesting to note that HD isn't the only OEM trying to reshape the future of sales and new bikes.

For an example, Yamaha will not be selling the FJR 1300 in Europe after mid year due to the new EU 5 emissions regulation (fook Europe I say).

I have read that the FJR will still be sold in the USA, but for how long who knows. Yamaha was hoping to sell many "Niken" 3 wheels bikes but the MSRP was quite high (had to recoup R&D costs I guess). In general the sport touring segment in the USA has been on the decline for a number of years and this is why BMW went with the bagger (K1600B) to try and compete with HD as GS sales (adventure bikes) is what you ride to go to Starbucks

BMW GS and R1200/1250 RT sales are keeping sales positive for the Bayerische Motoren Werke, but there are only so many people who need/want bikes.

IMHO the HD big V Twin is a work of engineering art and I have always loved that "unique sound".

The fact that HD will bring to market an off road adventure bike is commendable and I wish them luck with that.

One last note;

My friend was a sales Manager of a once popular BMW shop (now closed) said that new riders (not knowing brands or having any experience riding) were offering ridiculously low prices on new bikes.Their understanding of profit margins weren't a concern for them which resulted in a sale going south so to speak.

What will be will be, but I hope that HD will be able to weather the storm.

v4bob49 said:

Unfortunately motorcycle sales continue to decline throughout the industry, not just for Harley. The Big Four Japanese manufactures used to all have an extensive line of "cruiser style" V-Twin bikes. Now the have hardly any. Polaris discontinued the Victory line altogether.

It seems to be easy to bash the MoCo for what they are doing. But the reality is that they have to try to become more efficient in order to remain competitive. Such as closing the Kansas City plant and consolidating production at York.

They simply did not need the production capacity any longer. Sad situation, but that's the reality. At least H-D is trying to recruit new riders/younger people. I don't know how successful they've been so far.

As for where their revenue comes from, here are the numbers for 2019 taken from their fourth quarter report on their website:

Total vehicles shipped: 213939

Revenue from motorcycle sales: $3,538,963,000.00

General merchandise sales: $237,566,000.00

Parts & Accessories: $713,400,000.00

Total: $4,489,929,000.00

While the total revenue for 2019 is almost $4.5 billion, it is actually down about 8% from 2018 and when it was almost $5 billion.

Also, the total number of vehicles shipped is down 6.4% compared to 2018. UK

Click to expand...

Thanks for posting this up.

Kevin

jonfjr said:

Kevin,

It is also interesting to note that HD isn't the only OEM trying to reshape the future of sales and new bikes.

For an example, Yamaha will not be selling the FJR 1300 in Europe after mid year due to the new EU 5 emissions regulation (fook Europe I say).

I have read that the FJR will still be sold in the USA, but for how long who knows. Yamaha was hoping to sell many "Niken" 3 wheels bikes but the MSRP was quite high (had to recoup R&D costs I guess). In general the sport touring segment in the USA has been on the decline for a number of years and this is why BMW went with the bagger (K1600B) to try and compete with HD as GS sales (adventure bikes) is what you ride to go to Starbucks

BMW GS and R1200/1250 RT sales are keeping sales positive for the Bayerische Motoren Werke, but there are only so many people who need/want bikes.



IMHO the HD big V Twin is a work of engineering art and I have always loved that "unique sound".

The fact that HD will bring to market an off road adventure bike is commendable and I wish them luck with that.

One last note;

My friend was a sales Manager of a once popular BMW shop (now closed) said that new riders (not knowing brands or having any experience riding) were offering ridiculously low prices on new bikes.Their understanding of profit margins weren't a concern for them which resulted in a sale going south so to speak.

What will be will be, but I hope that HD will be able to weather the storm.

Click to expand...

I know it is crazy/foreign to think of Harley making electric bicycles, balance bikes and motorcycles. But they are doing what they believe they need to do to capture the market that is currently being raised on smartphones, screens and other influences so far from ours it is almost inconceivable.

There is a method in their "madness" that I have seen as clear as day recently.

A month ago I purchased and E-Bike for exercise. (a regular bike is just too hard on my knees).

I've been reading some on a few e-bike forums, and almost all folks that have e-bikes (and never ridden a motorcycle) talk about how "freeing" it feels to twist the throttle and go...about the fun of being "in the wind", about the "freedom they feel" when riding their e-bike.

These are all things that we, who ride motorcycles, already know. These folks on e-bikes are just discovering it. Most do not even know that they would love riding a motorcycle...and, in fact, they are riding one already, albeit a small one.

Now, picture a kid with an e-bike...especially a HD branded e-bike. A huge percentage of them are going to grow up and want to take the next step and get an electric motorcycle. It will be a natural progression for them.

In my opinion, HD is doing what it needs to do to survive. The biggest challenge they have is competing in regards to cost of production.

Kevin

DK Custom Products said:

I know it is crazy/foreign to think of Harley making electric bicycles, balance bikes and motorcycles. But they are doing what they believe they need to do to capture the market that is currently being raised on smartphones, screens and other influences so far from ours it is almost inconceivable.

There is a method in their "madness" that I have seen as clear as day recently.

A month ago I purchased and E-Bike for exercise. (a regular bike is just too hard on my knees).

I've been reading some on a few e-bike forums, and almost all folks that have e-bikes (and never ridden a motorcycle) talk about how "freeing" it feels to twist the throttle and go...about the fun of being "in the wind", about the "freedom they feel" when riding their e-bike.

These are all things that we, who ride motorcycles, already know. These folks on e-bikes are just discovering it. Most do not even know that they would love riding a motorcycle...and, in fact, they are riding one already, albeit a small one.

Now, picture a kid with an e-bike...especially a HD branded e-bike. A huge percentage of them are going to grow up and want to take the next step and get an electric motorcycle. It will be a natural progression for them.

In my opinion, HD is doing what it needs to do to survive. The biggest challenge they have is competing in regards to cost of production.

Kevin

Click to expand...

Cost of production is a good comment kevin.

When I see some of the MSRP tags on HD or BMW it makes me wonder if they could reduce these prices. BMW production employees are in a union and so are HD employees so that is one constant but does it drive the cost of making these bikes? I am sure it is relevant at some stage of the costing analysis.

The Harley web page really stinks this year. Indeed, they are trying to bring in some fresh riders, and if that's what they need to do to stay in business then good for them. Considering most "kids" can't even change a flat tire, I guess they have to find a product they will purchase. As for the layout of the web page... having worked in a corporate job once, the top usually has no clue as to what goes on below. They probably hired a third party business to create that page for them. Someone with no clue. Okay, that's enough from me.

David792 said:

The Harley web page really stinks this year. Indeed, they are trying to bring in some fresh riders, and if that's what they need to do to stay in business then good for them. Considering most "kids" can't even change a flat tire, I guess they have to find a product they will purchase. As for the layout of the web page... having worked in a corporate job once, the top usually has no clue as to what goes on below. They probably hired a third party business to create that page for them. Someone with no clue. Okay, that's enough from me.

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David,

Totally on the same page as you.

HD isn't the only Company that suffers from the "where do I go" from here web page design, but other Companies do as well. I made that point recently to a well known Company about the minefield of navigating their web site when the agent asked me to upload a file! I duly responded with, "where is the link for that" :Shrug:

Don't management check anything these days? Look at Boeing as an example of "out of sight, out of mind".

Nuff said.

Here's a link to a pretty well organized look at the newly labeled HD line-up.

https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/en/motorcycles/index.html

I have noticed that the HD websites for other countries are still showing Sportsters and Softails.

Kevin

jonfjr said:

Cost of production is a good comment kevin.

When I see some of the MSRP tags on HD or BMW it makes me wonder if they could reduce these prices. BMW production employees are in a union and so are HD employees so that is one constant but does it drive the cost of making these bikes? I am sure it is relevant at some stage of the costing analysis.

Click to expand...

I am retired from a union manufacturing job. At my time of employment the Co. told us we were 5% or 6% of the cost of the product! Union workers are making less now then the period i'm referring to. I'm thinking it's the top end that's added heavily to the cost, I know for a fact it is not the bottom!

sportster

DK Custom Products said:

Here's a link to a pretty well organized look at the newly labeled HD line-up.

https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/en/motorcycles/index.html

I have noticed that the HD websites for other countries are still showing Sportsters and Softails.



Kevin

Click to expand...

Who really cares which column they put it in, they are still sportsters and still look like sportsters. Any one wanting a sportster and doesn't know what they look like arent really interested anyway

Just went to the Harley website, to see if maybe the new President & CEO had done anything to reverse the trend away from calling a Sportster a Sportster and a Softail a Softail.



Looks like Sportys are still "Streets" and most Softails are still "Cruisers".

On another, but related, note....

Devin went and did it...bought an electric Harley for his son!


Kevin

At $600 a pop for these electric bikes they are trying to get the "new" riders ready for sticker shock LOL.

Mykneesbehurtin said:

At $600 a pop for these electric bikes they are trying to get the "new" riders ready for sticker shock LOL.

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:laugh::laugh::laugh:

Yep, could be. Did you see in the video how Gabe has a "Harley, just like my daddy". That is what HD wants. 12 years from now, he will probably have gone thru a few different HD e-bikes and will be "locked" in to the Harley brand.

That is what they want. Will it work? Only time will tell.

btw, for exercise, Mary and I got some e-bikes (non-Harley) half a year ago. We paid well over $1000 for each of them, plus, I have modded them both.

Kevin

Kevin John Deere, Case, International Farmall or whatever they are now. These places at least around us anyway past out toys tractor attachments books hats you name it. Guess what those young kids now either bleed green or red played with those machines and now buying them. called raise them from the start it works . I saw.my son and several others now bleed green and I suppose I do as well. But you can't compare John Deere to Harley oranges to apples so to speak.

I sure did get a kick out of watching Gabe riding his Harley. I was smiling from ear to ear. Sure wish my boys were back at that age.