Phoenix v5 brake bleeder

[Jack Klarich]

I was comfortable with "old" stuff, everything up to the advent of internal oiling, ecm's, fuel injection. Now hydraulics. Is there and precautions to vacuum bleeding clutch.

Vacuum bleeding will be OK, before you start, wipe any residue out of the master cylinder

This will be a BIG plus for you

HD in its wisdom ( or lack there of) allowed these units to be installed with IMO WAY TOO MUCH assembly lube

That would be the crud in the bottom of the cylinder

Same holds true for brake cylinders

The more you can get wiped out before bleeding the less chance of bad Ju JU later

OOPS, I kinda of strayed

Keep your master cylinder full at all times during bleeding

 

[Tucci]

JK

Thanks, I wasn't sure of doing the clutch, one reason the manual -- 2-95, 11. Measure release plate movement, bearing and pushrod.... I did not want to get into the primary side. If all it is pull old fluid and not over filling master cyl. I'm good to go

 

[MDO]

As far as the clutch fluid flushing, you may have a problem getting the cover off to access the actuator. My manual for my 2017 FW says to loosen the exhaust, but if you just loosen the heat shields in that area, you can get the cover off.

Like Jack said, I start by using a syringe & sucking out the old fluid & wiping any residue out of the bottom of the reservoir.

Then I refill it & flush with clean fluid, DOT 4.

Watch the Fix My Hog Videos, they have 1 for flushing the clutch & the brakes. Also cover everything up, that DOT 4 will eat your paint.

 

[Tucci]

MDO

Just read your post, went out in garage to compare the 15 exhaust with an enlarged "image" on my tablet, of 17 fw. It looks like the exhaust configuration on the M8 is completely different. I can slide my fingers under the clutch cover on mine, and at 250 lbs I've got Italian sausage fingers --- Thanks to you and JK for the tips (never listed in an hd manual) about wiping the master cylinder. Never realized it was assembly lube!

Just checked manual, no mention of removing exhaust, only remove cover. Dodged bullet on this one

 

[Old Road Dog]

The reverse bleeding procedure shown in the video confirms what Ive always suspected about this guy: Hes a friggin numbskull. You DO NOT push fluid from caliper to master cylinder.Thats asking for trouble.On my Dyna ( ABS) I bought new MC covers and modified the old ones by installing a nipple in the cover then used my Mity-Vac to push fluid from MC to caliper .Make sure MC is topped off at all times.Jims sells MC covers that allow you to reverse bleed but I think its a set.

 

[Tucci]

ORD

Zerk fittings?

Are all three covers the same size

 

[Jack Klarich]

Zerk fittings?

Are all three covers the same size

Are you referring to #4 If so then YES

 

[Tucci]

JK

Old Road Dog said he modified the mc covers. I was wondering if he drilled/taped zerks into them. I have in my collection several type brake bleeders, (hand pump vacuum, pneumatic vacuum, homemade gravity, etc).

Apparently i opened a pandora's box when i asked if anyone has "tried" reverse bleeding. Although I've gotten interesting responses. Almost like asking what's the best motor oil to use.

 

[Jack Klarich]

Old Road Dog said he modified the mc covers. I was wondering if he drilled/taped zerks into them. I have in my collection several type brake bleeders, (hand pump vacuum, pneumatic vacuum, homemade gravity, etc).

Apparently i opened a pandora's box when i asked if anyone has "tried" reverse bleeding. Although I've gotten interesting responses. Almost like asking what's the best motor oil to use.

I would like to see pictures of his covers

Not much meat on the covers to tap threads for longevity IMO Plus there would be no seat or shoulder for the fittings to seat?

Then again I have seen some pretty unusual things in my time

As far as a Pandora's Box, I say NAH, all good info in here

 

[Tucci]

JK

That's what i thought, but what works for one guy isn't right for everyone. I am even hesitant to put the fill bottle in the small mc to vacuum fluid out calipers, I have my wife add fluid as needed when using pneumatic vacuum, that way i can keep good seal on bleeder and close it off under vacuum.

 

[Jack Klarich]

That's what i thought, but what works for one guy isn't right for everyone. I am even hesitant to put the fill bottle in the small mc to vacuum fluid out calipers, I have my wife add fluid as needed when using pneumatic vacuum, that way i can keep good seal on bleeder and close it off under vacuum.

You have a GOOD tried and trued way of doing this

I have over the years tried just about all ways of bleeding hydraulic systems

We had some cars in the shop that were real problems to bleed

Enter the Amco pressure bleeder

This worked with air .The bleeder tank held about 4 gallons of fluid

Most systems only needed about 10 psi to bleed, the big plus was the fluid in the tank did NOT take on moisture as it was pressurized at all times

 

[Tucci]

JK

I learned everything from an old timer (which i am now), always said if you don't know why and how it works how are you going to repair it. He always used the type (different model) bleeder you mentioned until abs came on the scene. Then thousands of $$$ in snap-on etc.

 

[Old Road Dog]

Im a low tech kinda guy.I just drilled holes in the MC covers and epoxied copper nipples on.You can make a pressure bleeder from a new 1 gallon garden sprayer. The nice thing about this is you dont have to keep topping off.I tee'd tubeing to both front and rear mc's and bled both at the same time.Took the bike down the road and did several panic stops to activate the HCU ( made with inferior components BTW) went back and re-bled. No digital technician required.I havnt decided how Im gonna do the Freewheeler yet.Two year mark comes up this September.

 

[MDO]

I bled the front brake circuit on my Freewheeler the old fashion way with the addition of an inline check valve & it was simple, quick & worked just fine. I try not to make things more difficult than they need to be. Personally, I have enough problems without doing that. With no ABS, the Freewheeler is easy to bleed.

Whatever way you all chose to bleed yours, I'm sure it will work fine. Good luck.

 

[FuzzyWuzHe]

Ever had a song stick in your head?

Kind of what happened with this thread. I was kind of intrigued with the concept of pushing fluid up .. Kind of makes sense. Air would rather move up than down. Pushing the fluid up, leaves me with the issue of blowing fluid up over the bike.

Solution: (maybe) Vacuum Up?

I have a couple of reservoir covers in my "not in use pile". What if I drilled and tapped a reservoir cover to accept a bleeder valve. I could "pull" fluid up and out of the reservoir cover. I would tie the brake lever in a mid position. The only down side is pulling fluid through the master cylinder seals. Would still need two people to do this, but the second one would just be pumping the bleeder, all the control would be at the bleeder and once the bleeder was closed, no way to get air in.

Something to dwell on ... good news ... since I'm rehabbing a knee, I have lots of time to Dwell ... LOL .. I'd love to hear the groups thoughts of the "pull up" ideas.

 

[MDO]

Kind of what happened with this thread. I was kind of intrigued with the concept of pushing fluid up .. Kind of makes sense. Air would rather move up than down. Pushing the fluid up, leaves me with the issue of blowing fluid up over the bike.

Solution: (maybe) Vacuum Up?

I have a couple of reservoir covers in my "not in use pile". What if I drilled and tapped a reservoir cover to accept a bleeder valve. I could "pull" fluid up and out of the reservoir cover. I would tie the brake lever in a mid position. The only down side is pulling fluid through the master cylinder seals. Would still need two people to do this, but the second one would just be pumping the bleeder, all the control would be at the bleeder and once the bleeder was closed, no way to get air in.

Something to dwell on ... good news ... since I'm rehabbing a knee, I have lots of time to Dwell ... LOL .. I'd love to hear the groups thoughts of the "pull up" ideas.

I just think, under normal circumstances, it's not needed. I also think, like Jack stated, drilling that thin aluminum MC cover is asking for trouble. When I tested my homemade bleeder bottle & in-line check valve, that goes on right behind the bleed screw, it was on my 2005 Honda Sabre that had never had the brakes serviced. Their was some minor bubbles in the front circuit, I believe from moisture & the rear disk line was fine & that was 15 year old fluid.

The check valve ensures you can't make a mistake & suck air back in & it worked great.

Just for exchanging fluid every few years, I feel that simpler is better.

Those Fix My Hog guys were replacing brake lines, that's why they did the more thorough bleeding.

They have videos on routine fluid flushing & they do it the old fashioned way.

 

[Jack Klarich]

Kind of what happened with this thread. I was kind of intrigued with the concept of pushing fluid up .. Kind of makes sense. Air would rather move up than down. Pushing the fluid up, leaves me with the issue of blowing fluid up over the bike.

Solution: (maybe) Vacuum Up?

I have a couple of reservoir covers in my "not in use pile". What if I drilled and tapped a reservoir cover to accept a bleeder valve. I could "pull" fluid up and out of the reservoir cover. I would tie the brake lever in a mid position. The only down side is pulling fluid through the master cylinder seals. Would still need two people to do this, but the second one would just be pumping the bleeder, all the control would be at the bleeder and once the bleeder was closed, no way to get air in.

Something to dwell on ... good news ... since I'm rehabbing a knee, I have lots of time to Dwell ... LOL .. I'd love to hear the groups thoughts of the "pull up" ideas.

If you tie the lever midway you will have the compensator port in the master cylinder open, thus the fluid will make its way past the seal, no need for a second helper

If you MUST pump the brakes, use slow and 1/2 pumps

This will insure not to churn more air bubbles and will not move the piston seal to far so you do not roll the lip of the seal