Engine Date

[DeathBySnuSnu]

Ok.

That would be 109.

So that is a flywheel for a 6 volt starter.

The 6v starter had a different bendix gear.

Starter will run fine on 12v, just dont crank for extended periods. Wait on it to quit spinning before turning the key again.

Check the gen and regulator.

It dont have an original distributor.

I bet it has been converted to 12v.

So now I feel it is a 66 model 1300

 

[vwbug72501]

Since it's a 6 volt FW on unknown pedigree here's something else to check. (I'm doing this from memory from 40 years ago now.) I think the 40 horse (1200cc) crank had a different dimension on the step on the FW end. When we rebuilt cranks back then we always ground the cranks for the deeper step. I can't remember if it was the 1200 crank or the 1300/1500/1600 crank. If you didn't do that you could get a crank/FW combination where the shallower step on the crank would not allow the deeper stepped FW to fully seat and the gland nut would loosen. You could set the end play shims and all but it wouldn't stay together. Back then we were dune buggying on a budget and one of the crew worked for an engine rebuilder so we could get "backdoor" pricing. If we could make it fit, we used it!

If anybody out there has better information, please chime in.

There is also a "shade tree" fix for loose dowel pins. You can buy a drill fixture for installing 8 dowel pins in the crank and FW. If you set the fixture pins in the bad crank shaft holes and drill 4 more holes you can rotate the FW to the new holes. This can be done without splitting the cases IF you are REALLY careful about chips.

 

[DeathBySnuSnu]

I seem to remeber a lot of the same.

The 40hp 1200 from a distance looks the same but had very little that will interchange with anything else.

If I remember correctly......the 40hp and earlier flywheels did not have the o ring or the step for it to seat on.

It is entirely possible that this is an early short axle 6v trans and the engine is a later model 66 to 71. And that someone tryed to put the 40hp 6v flywheel on the later engine that it does not mate to correctly.

 

[vwbug72501]

Not to hijack the thread, but I have to tell on myself. Back in the day I built a "mongrel" VW engine for my buggy and when finished, it started right up and idled beautifully. Then I put it in gear and tried to accelerate. You could outrun the buggy on foot it was so gutless. Long story short, after checking and rechecking everything 3 times, I pulled the engine and tore it back down. I had built the engine with 1500 cases and one of our reground 1200 cranks! With a 64mm stroke rather than a 69mm stroke made for a very detuned engine!:blush:

Coulda used a turbo/supercharger for that one.

 

[Diamondtrike]

I seem to remeber a lot of the same.

The 40hp 1200 from a distance looks the same but had very little that will interchange with anything else.

If I remember correctly......the 40hp and earlier flywheels did not have the o ring or the step for it to seat on.

It is entirely possible that this is an early short axle 6v trans and the engine is a later model 66 to 71. And that someone tryed to put the 40hp 6v flywheel on the later engine that it does not mate to correctly.

the flywheel has the o ring, i did notice that it looks like someone ground the bell housing in a few spots for clearance. i had notice that if i didnt wait for a few seconds between cranking attempts it the starter would sound like it was grinding on the flywheel. how can i find out if it is a 6v starter? my main concern right now is to get the correct rear main seal so i can get it put back together and running, for a little joyriding until i can save up enough for a complete rebuild. (about $1700:xzqxz

 

[vwbug72501]

Voltage rating should be stamped on body of starter motor. 6v and 12v starters have different diameter shafts that insert into the bellhousing. I believe that the 12v is smaller. To further complicate things there are adapter bushings available that fit into the bellhousing hole to allow 6v starters in 12v transaxles and vice versa.

It is common practice when installing a 12v engine/clutch/flywheel into a 6v transaxle to have to relieve the material around the engine mounting hole bosses. This may not pertain to your current setup but the transaxle might have had a 12v flywheel installed at some time in its life.

You can further identify your transaxle by locating the numbers stamped on the case. They are located on the driver's side of the case at about the 7 o'clock position behind the axle tube when viewed from the rear. Unfortunately, VW transaxles can be mixed and matched just like the engines.

Check out http://www.thesamba.com

Also, a Bently VW manual is a good reference. You can probably find one used on the samba.

 

[Diamondtrike]

Voltage rating should be stamped on body of starter motor. 6v and 12v starters have different diameter shafts that insert into the bellhousing. I believe that the 12v is smaller. To further complicate things there are adapter bushings available that fit into the bellhousing hole to allow 6v starters in 12v transaxles and vice versa.

It is common practice when installing a 12v engine/clutch/flywheel into a 6v transaxle to have to relieve the material around the engine mounting hole bosses. This may not pertain to your current setup but the transaxle might have had a 12v flywheel installed at some time in its life.

You can further identify your transaxle by locating the numbers stamped on the case. They are located on the driver's side of the case at about the 7 o'clock position behind the axle tube when viewed from the rear. Unfortunately, VW transaxles can be mixed and matched just like the engines.

Check out http://www.thesamba.com

Also, a Bently VW manual is a good reference. You can probably find one used on the samba.

i think i have searched the entire engine and transmission to find some numbers that would help pin down what year it is, sadly the only numbers i have found are from the mold halves in manufacturing. it seems that every place there is supposed to be an id number are smooth. so other than not being able to crank for long periods and having to wait between cranking the engine, having the 6v starter wont hurt with the 12v battery? will the original generator be enough to keep the 12v battery charged or will i need to change to a 12v generator? Keep in mind this trike belonged to my father in law that passed away recently and i want to keep it as close to the way he had it as possible.

 

[vwbug72501]

You already have a 12v generator (6v lighting is like driving by braille) so the 6v starter will work fine. Keep your engine in tune and don't abuse the starter. I ran one for years on a daily driver baja bug of mine.

Here's a picture of where the transaxle numbers are. Many times they are obscured by a collection of road grime. The first 2 letters are the important part for year determination.

 

[Diamondtrike]

You already have a 12v generator (6v lighting is like driving by braille) so the 6v starter will work fine. Keep your engine in tune and don't abuse the starter. I ran one for years on a daily driver baja bug of mine.

May i ask how you determined that mine is a 12v generator?

 

[vwbug72501]

Yours is a 1 year only 1967 12v generator with push on terminals and remote mounted regulator.



Here is the 6v generator. It is a smaller diameter and has the regulator mounted on top of it.

 

[DeathBySnuSnu]

Good catch!

I missed the 67 generator.

Now that might mean it is a 67 model 1500cc.

Maybe it was put onto the early trans by grinding the extra clearance. Then did not have the starter for it and then changed to early 6v flywheel.

Buncha possibilities.....

I was leaning towards being a converted 6v engine because the distributor and coil have been changed to aftermarket items.

 

[Diamondtrike]

Yours is a 1 year only 1967 12v generator with push on terminals and remote mounted regulator.

View attachment 45756

Here is the 6v generator. It is a smaller diameter and has the regulator mounted on top of it.

View attachment 45757

Awesome thanks!

 

[Diamondtrike]

I took a few pictures of the starter in the bell housing maybe yall can determine if it is a 6 or a 12v



Sorry I couldn't really get to the back side because I did have any help to get the body off.

 

[vwbug72501]

Starter is mounted by 2 bolts. One is the motor mounting bolt and the other is a short bolt across from it on the bellhousing casting. (to the right in the picture) Just pop it off and the starter slides out towards the front. Then you can read the P/N and voltage stampings on the starter motor body.

In the words of Johnny Cash's "One Piece At A Time":

Ugh!, what model is it?

Well, It's a '49, '50, '51, '52, '53, '54, '55, '56

'57, '58' 59' automobile

It's a '60, '61, '62, '63, '64, '65, '66, '67

'68, '69, '70 automobile.

 

[Loner]

If I am reading everything correctly here, you've already determined that you have a 6-volt type transaxle that has been clearanced for a 200mm flywheel. You have a 180mm flywheel installed (i.e., 6-volt type), so the starter has to be a 6-volt starter to mate with the 180mm flywheel teeth, irregardless of whether it is powered with 6 volts or 12 volts.

As already mentioned, 6-volt starter spinning on 12-volts is a wonderful combination. I've had several in the past and have never, ever had any problems at all.

 

[Diamondtrike]

so now its on to the online parts stores to try and find the stuff i need to get this thing rolling again!

 

[Diamondtrike]

That brings me to another question, where does everyone order parts from? I found everything I need on jbugs.com but I read some of their reviews and most people didn't have much good to say about them.

 

[DeathBySnuSnu]

Over in the other thread you said.....28pict.....

That is a 1200cc 40hp carb.

 

[Diamondtrike]

Over in the other thread you said.....28pict.....

That is a 1200cc 40hp carb.

That's good to know, Thanks! BTW I just subscribed to your thread about the complete rebuild of your trike, gotta say that thing is gonna be sick!! I cant wait to see the finished project!:clapping:

 

[DeathBySnuSnu]

Yeah 50 pages of going from Heavily Modified

To Super Heavily Modified...

The first time I built it I had several years into it.

That was before cell phones and always having a camera in your pocket. So it is not documented, but I do have an old stray pic here and there.